Ken Moser 2012 Session 4
Series: Mega Surge
Speaker: Ken Moser
Date: 2nd June 2012
00:00:00 --> 00:00:01 We're going to keep going.
00:00:03 --> 00:00:05 We're right on schedule, which is amazing.
00:00:06 --> 00:00:09 And then we're going to have a good, healthy lunch break
00:00:09 --> 00:00:10 of about an hour and 15.
00:00:10 --> 00:00:13 There's a stack of stuff over there to eat.
00:00:14 --> 00:00:15 And then we're going to come back,
00:00:16 --> 00:00:17 talk a little bit more about theory,
00:00:17 --> 00:00:18 and then go to practice.
00:00:19 --> 00:00:21 So, you know, quick review.
00:00:22 --> 00:00:24 The youth ministry world is changing.
00:00:25 --> 00:00:28 The people who've pushed a model
00:00:28 --> 00:00:30 that's called the attractional model,
00:00:31 --> 00:00:32 do things to attract kids
00:00:32 --> 00:00:34 and then move them into the faith,
00:00:34 --> 00:00:37 they're now rethinking it big time
00:00:37 --> 00:00:39 because of the dreaded pyramid.
00:00:39 --> 00:00:41 We're losing most of our kids.
00:00:42 --> 00:00:45 And I'm arguing that they're thinking pragmatically.
00:00:45 --> 00:00:47 What will attract kids?
00:00:47 --> 00:00:48 We need to think theologically.
00:00:49 --> 00:00:51 What does God want us to do to attract kids?
00:00:52 --> 00:00:54 And so I want to argue the three pillars.
00:00:54 --> 00:00:55 We be a Christian youth group.
00:00:55 --> 00:00:58 That will mean that maybe some of our non-Christians
00:00:58 --> 00:00:59 will leave.
00:01:00 --> 00:01:01 And I don't like that.
00:01:02 --> 00:01:03 But that's sometimes the way it happens.
00:01:03 --> 00:01:04 Let's be a Christian youth group
00:01:04 --> 00:01:05 that does Christian things
00:01:05 --> 00:01:06 and let's do them in a way
00:01:06 --> 00:01:08 that attracts young people.
00:01:09 --> 00:01:11 Now, I want to take a sideways step
00:01:11 --> 00:01:14 and talk about discipleship and relationships.
00:01:14 --> 00:01:17 Because, again, I think in Sydney
00:01:17 --> 00:01:20 we lose some of the relational thinking.
00:01:20 --> 00:01:22 And if I can be brutally honest,
00:01:22 --> 00:01:25 I think our thinking goes like this.
00:01:26 --> 00:01:28 All we have to do is teach the Bible
00:01:28 --> 00:01:30 and everything else falls into place.
00:01:31 --> 00:01:33 That's a really crazy thought.
00:01:34 --> 00:01:36 Like, it makes no sense at all.
00:01:37 --> 00:01:39 And I've heard a number of ministers say that.
00:01:39 --> 00:01:40 I've heard ministers have said to me,
00:01:41 --> 00:01:44 my job is to preach and to pray.
00:01:44 --> 00:01:46 And my response is,
00:01:46 --> 00:01:47 well, you're a lazy guy
00:01:47 --> 00:01:48 who doesn't read his Bible.
00:01:49 --> 00:01:51 Because the Bible never says that.
00:01:52 --> 00:01:54 Paul was the most relational of guys.
00:01:55 --> 00:01:56 He's hanging out with Timothy.
00:01:56 --> 00:01:58 He's hanging out with Titus.
00:01:58 --> 00:02:00 He says, we loved you so much.
00:02:00 --> 00:02:00 We're going to look at this in a minute.
00:02:00 --> 00:02:02 We loved you so much
00:02:02 --> 00:02:03 that we spent our lives with you.
00:02:04 --> 00:02:05 I said lives like a mad scientist.
00:02:05 --> 00:02:07 Our lives with you.
00:02:10 --> 00:02:11 It's all about relationship.
00:02:12 --> 00:02:13 Relationship is key to everything.
00:02:14 --> 00:02:15 God is relationship.
00:02:16 --> 00:02:18 He is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
00:02:18 --> 00:02:21 He has existed forever
00:02:21 --> 00:02:22 in perfect relationship.
00:02:23 --> 00:02:24 He sends his Son to die on the cross for us
00:02:24 --> 00:02:27 so that we can have perfect relationship.
00:02:27 --> 00:02:28 Heaven is perfect relationship.
00:02:29 --> 00:02:29 The kingdom of God
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 is about perfect relationship.
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 We are to be filled with love, joy, peace,
00:02:33 --> 00:02:34 and the Holy Spirit.
00:02:34 --> 00:02:37 It's all about relationship.
00:02:37 --> 00:02:39 So if you want to see things happen,
00:02:39 --> 00:02:42 you have to build in a relational structure.
00:02:42 --> 00:02:44 And by the way,
00:02:45 --> 00:02:47 the old style of youth ministry
00:02:47 --> 00:02:48 that many of us grew up in
00:02:48 --> 00:02:49 is actually not very good at relating
00:02:49 --> 00:02:51 because we run a mixer.
00:02:52 --> 00:02:53 Here's your homework.
00:02:54 --> 00:02:55 Go on a website
00:02:55 --> 00:02:56 and Google mixer.
00:02:57 --> 00:03:00 Google Christian youth mixer.
00:03:02 --> 00:03:03 You'll find a whole bunch of them.
00:03:04 --> 00:03:06 Look at them and ask the question,
00:03:06 --> 00:03:09 does this mixer mix?
00:03:11 --> 00:03:12 And quite often,
00:03:12 --> 00:03:14 you don't even communicate with the person.
00:03:15 --> 00:03:17 You get something from them
00:03:17 --> 00:03:19 or you, do you have red hair?
00:03:19 --> 00:03:21 And you do something else.
00:03:22 --> 00:03:26 We've really programmed out relationships.
00:03:27 --> 00:03:28 And when you read Scripture,
00:03:28 --> 00:03:30 now here's a long Bible passage.
00:03:30 --> 00:03:33 There's so much good stuff in this Bible passage.
00:03:33 --> 00:03:34 It's just,
00:03:34 --> 00:03:36 1 Thessalonians is like my favorite book.
00:03:36 --> 00:03:37 I love 1 Thessalonians.
00:03:38 --> 00:03:39 And especially chapter 2.
00:03:41 --> 00:03:42 Paul says in verse 6,
00:03:42 --> 00:03:43 as apostles of Christ,
00:03:43 --> 00:03:44 we could have been a burden to you.
00:03:45 --> 00:03:46 They could have thrown their weight around.
00:03:46 --> 00:03:47 They could have said,
00:03:47 --> 00:03:47 hey guys,
00:03:47 --> 00:03:49 can you support us financially?
00:03:50 --> 00:03:51 We're important.
00:03:52 --> 00:03:54 But we were gentle among you.
00:03:54 --> 00:03:55 What were we like?
00:03:55 --> 00:03:58 We were like the number one relational structure
00:03:58 --> 00:04:00 in a person's life.
00:04:00 --> 00:04:03 We were like a mother caring for her little children.
00:04:04 --> 00:04:05 Heavy relational term.
00:04:06 --> 00:04:07 We loved you so much
00:04:07 --> 00:04:08 that we were delighted to share with you
00:04:08 --> 00:04:10 not only the gospel,
00:04:10 --> 00:04:11 but our lives as well
00:04:11 --> 00:04:13 because you've become so dear to us.
00:04:13 --> 00:04:14 Now by the way,
00:04:14 --> 00:04:16 that verse is always misinterpreted
00:04:16 --> 00:04:18 because if you read youth ministry books,
00:04:18 --> 00:04:19 they will say,
00:04:20 --> 00:04:21 get to know kids,
00:04:21 --> 00:04:23 earn the right to be heard,
00:04:23 --> 00:04:25 and then tell them the gospel.
00:04:26 --> 00:04:27 And they'll go to this verse.
00:04:27 --> 00:04:29 So I met with one of the heaviest
00:04:29 --> 00:04:32 of youth ministry educators in the world,
00:04:32 --> 00:04:33 a great guy,
00:04:33 --> 00:04:34 a terrific guy.
00:04:34 --> 00:04:35 But he quoted that,
00:04:36 --> 00:04:36 and I said,
00:04:36 --> 00:04:36 dude,
00:04:37 --> 00:04:37 I said,
00:04:37 --> 00:04:38 golly,
00:04:38 --> 00:04:40 have you read 1 Thessalonians 2.8?
00:04:41 --> 00:04:44 Paul goes to Thessalonica in Acts 17,
00:04:44 --> 00:04:46 and he preaches the gospel
00:04:46 --> 00:04:48 for three Sabbaths,
00:04:48 --> 00:04:51 and then a relationship forms,
00:04:51 --> 00:04:52 and we're looking at it together,
00:04:52 --> 00:04:52 and he goes,
00:04:52 --> 00:04:53 oh gosh,
00:04:53 --> 00:04:54 I never saw that.
00:04:54 --> 00:04:57 What this verse is,
00:04:57 --> 00:04:58 Paul shares the gospel,
00:04:58 --> 00:04:59 and then becomes friends.
00:04:59 --> 00:05:00 No,
00:05:00 --> 00:05:01 I think you can become friends first,
00:05:01 --> 00:05:02 and then share the gospel.
00:05:02 --> 00:05:03 I'm just saying,
00:05:03 --> 00:05:04 that's not what this verse says.
00:05:05 --> 00:05:07 Notice what this verse does say.
00:05:07 --> 00:05:10 It's not just about preaching the gospel.
00:05:11 --> 00:05:12 Ciara comes to youth group,
00:05:12 --> 00:05:12 she's 11.
00:05:13 --> 00:05:13 Hello,
00:05:13 --> 00:05:14 young Ciara,
00:05:14 --> 00:05:15 sit down,
00:05:15 --> 00:05:15 because I'm preaching,
00:05:16 --> 00:05:16 baby.
00:05:16 --> 00:05:16 Ah,
00:05:16 --> 00:05:20 see you later.
00:05:20 --> 00:05:21 I've got to go pray.
00:05:24 --> 00:05:25 She'd be like,
00:05:26 --> 00:05:26 what are you doing,
00:05:26 --> 00:05:27 man?
00:05:27 --> 00:05:28 Let's go hang out.
00:05:28 --> 00:05:29 Let's go,
00:05:29 --> 00:05:31 let's go eat at the McDonald's,
00:05:31 --> 00:05:31 but that was kind of like,
00:05:32 --> 00:05:33 you didn't go to that McDonald's.
00:05:33 --> 00:05:34 That was kind of,
00:05:34 --> 00:05:35 you.
00:05:35 --> 00:05:37 Ask us later about the McDonald's,
00:05:37 --> 00:05:38 right across the street from our church.
00:05:38 --> 00:05:40 Don't buy a milkshake.
00:05:40 --> 00:05:40 Anyway,
00:05:40 --> 00:05:47 so you've got to build in life,
00:05:47 --> 00:05:48 and relationship,
00:05:49 --> 00:05:51 and getting to know each other,
00:05:52 --> 00:05:52 all that kind of thing.
00:05:52 --> 00:05:53 We're going to talk about that in just a second.
00:05:55 --> 00:05:56 Surely you remember,
00:05:56 --> 00:05:56 brothers,
00:05:56 --> 00:05:57 our toils and hardship.
00:05:58 --> 00:05:58 We work not,
00:05:58 --> 00:05:59 may not be burned to you.
00:05:59 --> 00:06:00 Verse 10,
00:06:00 --> 00:06:01 you are witnesses,
00:06:01 --> 00:06:02 and so is God,
00:06:02 --> 00:06:03 of how holy,
00:06:03 --> 00:06:03 righteous,
00:06:03 --> 00:06:04 and blameless we were among you,
00:06:04 --> 00:06:05 believe.
00:06:05 --> 00:06:07 You know that we dealt each with you.
00:06:07 --> 00:06:07 Here we go.
00:06:08 --> 00:06:09 Heavy relational term.
00:06:09 --> 00:06:11 Either the primary or secondary relationship
00:06:11 --> 00:06:12 in a kid's life.
00:06:13 --> 00:06:13 Who knows?
00:06:13 --> 00:06:14 Who's more important,
00:06:14 --> 00:06:14 father or mother?
00:06:14 --> 00:06:15 Who knows?
00:06:15 --> 00:06:17 But we were like a father.
00:06:19 --> 00:06:22 That's how intimate of a relationship we had with you.
00:06:22 --> 00:06:23 And what did we do?
00:06:23 --> 00:06:25 We did what a good dad does.
00:06:25 --> 00:06:26 We encouraged you.
00:06:27 --> 00:06:27 We said,
00:06:27 --> 00:06:28 you're doing well.
00:06:28 --> 00:06:29 You're doing great.
00:06:29 --> 00:06:30 It's excellent that you're praying.
00:06:31 --> 00:06:32 It's excellent that you're growing in the faith.
00:06:32 --> 00:06:33 This is fantastic.
00:06:33 --> 00:06:34 Stay with it.
00:06:35 --> 00:06:36 We comforted you.
00:06:36 --> 00:06:37 I know it's hard.
00:06:37 --> 00:06:39 I know people give you a hard time for being a Christian.
00:06:40 --> 00:06:41 I know God seems mysterious.
00:06:42 --> 00:06:44 I know his sovereignty is hard to understand.
00:06:44 --> 00:06:45 I know all that.
00:06:46 --> 00:06:47 Talk with me about it.
00:06:47 --> 00:06:49 And we urged you,
00:06:49 --> 00:06:50 keep going.
00:06:50 --> 00:06:51 Come to youth group.
00:06:52 --> 00:06:53 Keep reading your Bible
00:06:53 --> 00:06:55 to live lives worthy of God
00:06:55 --> 00:06:56 who calls you to this kingdom.
00:06:56 --> 00:06:57 And we also thank God
00:06:57 --> 00:06:59 because when you receive the word,
00:06:59 --> 00:07:01 you accept it as it actually is the word of God.
00:07:02 --> 00:07:06 There's just so much relational good stuff right there.
00:07:06 --> 00:07:08 2 Timothy 3.
00:07:09 --> 00:07:10 Really famous passage.
00:07:11 --> 00:07:14 We concentrate on verse 16.
00:07:14 --> 00:07:15 Rightly so.
00:07:15 --> 00:07:17 It's just tremendous.
00:07:18 --> 00:07:19 Doctrinally super important.
00:07:20 --> 00:07:21 But notice the first bit.
00:07:21 --> 00:07:22 Paul's writing to Timothy.
00:07:22 --> 00:07:23 He says,
00:07:23 --> 00:07:23 Timothy,
00:07:23 --> 00:07:24 you're going through a hard time.
00:07:24 --> 00:07:26 Everybody who wants to live a God and life
00:07:26 --> 00:07:27 in Christ Jesus
00:07:27 --> 00:07:28 will be persecuted.
00:07:29 --> 00:07:30 The world doesn't like Jesus.
00:07:30 --> 00:07:32 The world doesn't like you.
00:07:32 --> 00:07:35 Evil men and imposters
00:07:35 --> 00:07:36 will go from bad to worse.
00:07:36 --> 00:07:37 Deceiving and deceiving.
00:07:38 --> 00:07:38 But as for you,
00:07:39 --> 00:07:40 don't be like those evil men.
00:07:40 --> 00:07:41 You see them.
00:07:41 --> 00:07:42 They're succeeding.
00:07:42 --> 00:07:43 They're popular.
00:07:44 --> 00:07:44 People love them.
00:07:45 --> 00:07:46 They're splitting churches.
00:07:46 --> 00:07:47 Kind of in the context of the passage.
00:07:48 --> 00:07:49 They're splitting churches.
00:07:49 --> 00:07:51 They're getting into house churches.
00:07:51 --> 00:07:53 And they're dividing it and everything.
00:07:53 --> 00:07:55 Don't be like them.
00:07:55 --> 00:07:56 As for you,
00:07:57 --> 00:07:59 continue in what you've learned
00:07:59 --> 00:08:01 and become convinced of.
00:08:02 --> 00:08:04 Paul doesn't say because it's true,
00:08:04 --> 00:08:05 even though it is true.
00:08:06 --> 00:08:08 Continue what you've learned
00:08:08 --> 00:08:10 because you know those
00:08:10 --> 00:08:11 from whom you've learned it.
00:08:12 --> 00:08:14 You had a relationship with these people
00:08:14 --> 00:08:16 and you could just see the way
00:08:16 --> 00:08:19 Scripture had transformed their life.
00:08:19 --> 00:08:21 And as you got to know them,
00:08:21 --> 00:08:21 you just thought,
00:08:22 --> 00:08:23 this is so trustworthy
00:08:23 --> 00:08:24 because the people who taught it to me
00:08:24 --> 00:08:25 are so trustworthy.
00:08:26 --> 00:08:28 Probably Timothy's grandmother
00:08:28 --> 00:08:29 and mother Lois and Eunice
00:08:29 --> 00:08:30 and Paul as well.
00:08:31 --> 00:08:33 And it just really changed you.
00:08:34 --> 00:08:35 And from infancy,
00:08:35 --> 00:08:36 you were taught the Scriptures
00:08:36 --> 00:08:38 which make you wise
00:08:38 --> 00:08:39 and God-breathed,
00:08:39 --> 00:08:40 et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
00:08:41 --> 00:08:42 Just tremendous stuff.
00:08:42 --> 00:08:44 Continue in what you've learned
00:08:44 --> 00:08:46 because you know those
00:08:46 --> 00:08:47 from whom you've learned it.
00:08:48 --> 00:08:50 So that means Ciara was not,
00:08:50 --> 00:08:51 sorry, Ciara,
00:08:51 --> 00:08:52 I hope you don't mind me using it so much.
00:08:52 --> 00:08:54 Sorry, Ciara was not in my Bible study group.
00:08:54 --> 00:08:55 Was she in your Bible study group?
00:08:56 --> 00:08:56 Yeah.
00:08:56 --> 00:08:58 But Ciara was in Julie's Bible study group,
00:08:58 --> 00:08:59 you know, more appropriate.
00:08:59 --> 00:09:00 Julie the ministry of Ciara.
00:09:01 --> 00:09:03 And Julie and Ciara got to know each other
00:09:03 --> 00:09:05 as they learned the Scriptures.
00:09:06 --> 00:09:07 And outside of the Scriptures,
00:09:08 --> 00:09:09 they'd have coffee together,
00:09:09 --> 00:09:10 meals together.
00:09:10 --> 00:09:12 We'd have Ciara over to our house.
00:09:12 --> 00:09:13 A whole bunch of stuff.
00:09:14 --> 00:09:16 Lonnie, I'll never forget the time
00:09:16 --> 00:09:17 we went to the drive-in movie together.
00:09:17 --> 00:09:18 It was fantastic.
00:09:18 --> 00:09:19 Shanghai Nights.
00:09:21 --> 00:09:22 Two, six, eight.
00:09:22 --> 00:09:22 Which one?
00:09:22 --> 00:09:23 It was one of those.
00:09:24 --> 00:09:24 I don't know what it was.
00:09:24 --> 00:09:25 Two.
00:09:25 --> 00:09:25 Yeah.
00:09:25 --> 00:09:26 Sharing life together.
00:09:27 --> 00:09:30 Now, relationships are key to everything.
00:09:31 --> 00:09:32 So look at your youth group.
00:09:32 --> 00:09:34 Mark DeVries in Sustainable Youth Ministry
00:09:34 --> 00:09:36 says you have to have balcony time.
00:09:37 --> 00:09:39 You need to spend an hour of your week
00:09:39 --> 00:09:41 and look at the youth group from the balcony
00:09:41 --> 00:09:44 and just dissect it.
00:09:45 --> 00:09:46 Look at it.
00:09:46 --> 00:09:48 And so ask your youth group,
00:09:48 --> 00:09:51 are we promoting good relationships?
00:09:51 --> 00:09:53 Are people getting to know each other?
00:09:53 --> 00:09:55 Are youth leaders getting to know youth leaders?
00:09:55 --> 00:09:58 Are youth leaders unified with each other?
00:09:58 --> 00:10:01 Are youth leaders getting to know kids deeply?
00:10:01 --> 00:10:03 Are youth getting to know each other?
00:10:03 --> 00:10:06 Are the youth getting to know the church together?
00:10:06 --> 00:10:08 What is our relational structure
00:10:08 --> 00:10:09 and how is it working?
00:10:09 --> 00:10:10 Because it's key.
00:10:11 --> 00:10:13 Godly relationships, committed relationships.
00:10:13 --> 00:10:18 Your youth group stands or falls on this issue.
00:10:20 --> 00:10:21 Now, one of the...
00:10:21 --> 00:10:22 I've got to be careful what I say,
00:10:22 --> 00:10:24 but one of the...
00:10:24 --> 00:10:35 We have sets of rules that are really helpful
00:10:35 --> 00:10:38 to make sure that our relationships aren't misconstrued
00:10:38 --> 00:10:41 or get out of line.
00:10:41 --> 00:10:43 Those are really good things and they're necessary.
00:10:43 --> 00:10:47 But we must be careful that those rules don't say to us
00:10:47 --> 00:10:49 we actually can't have relationships.
00:10:49 --> 00:10:53 And some youth leaders have used some of the rules
00:10:53 --> 00:10:55 put into place, which are really good rules,
00:10:56 --> 00:11:00 to say I can't have a milkshake at McDonald's
00:11:00 --> 00:11:01 with a young person.
00:11:02 --> 00:11:03 And we've got to be careful of that
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06 because that will rob a very important
00:11:06 --> 00:11:10 and needed aspect of youth ministry.
00:11:11 --> 00:11:13 So think through your structure.
00:11:14 --> 00:11:17 And I want you to think about relationships in two ways.
00:11:17 --> 00:11:19 I want you to think about youth groups organizationally
00:11:19 --> 00:11:21 and pastorally.
00:11:22 --> 00:11:23 So this is a fairly simple diagram.
00:11:24 --> 00:11:26 Most of you are with me on this,
00:11:26 --> 00:11:28 so we don't need to spend more than a minute on it.
00:11:29 --> 00:11:30 But that's your youth group.
00:11:31 --> 00:11:33 And you need to break it up into small groups.
00:11:33 --> 00:11:34 Most of us do that.
00:11:38 --> 00:11:40 You probably shouldn't give a public talk with a Tic Tac
00:11:40 --> 00:11:42 because suddenly you had it
00:11:42 --> 00:11:44 and then you don't have it anymore.
00:11:44 --> 00:11:47 So if any of you see it, just point it out later.
00:11:47 --> 00:11:49 There's still some life in that Tic Tac.
00:11:49 --> 00:11:49 Keep going.
00:11:50 --> 00:11:52 Now, that's my youth group.
00:11:54 --> 00:11:57 What's the first major division in your youth group?
00:11:58 --> 00:11:59 It's real obvious.
00:12:00 --> 00:12:01 Boys and girls.
00:12:01 --> 00:12:01 That's right.
00:12:02 --> 00:12:05 So you split your youth group into boys and girls.
00:12:05 --> 00:12:06 And for obvious reasons,
00:12:06 --> 00:12:09 I don't even really need to say it,
00:12:09 --> 00:12:11 but it's easier, better, more productive
00:12:11 --> 00:12:13 if males deal with males, girls deal with males
00:12:13 --> 00:12:16 in the small group relational setting like that.
00:12:16 --> 00:12:18 So split your youth group up
00:12:18 --> 00:12:24 into sexes and into grades or years.
00:12:24 --> 00:12:28 And what years and grades you split it up to,
00:12:28 --> 00:12:31 that's for you and your culture and your ministry.
00:12:31 --> 00:12:33 Especially if you've got a lot of leaders
00:12:33 --> 00:12:34 and a lot of kids,
00:12:34 --> 00:12:36 year seven, year eight, year nine, year ten.
00:12:36 --> 00:12:37 Most of us don't.
00:12:37 --> 00:12:39 So we have to break it up into maybe year seven and eight,
00:12:39 --> 00:12:40 year nine and ten.
00:12:41 --> 00:12:45 And so you then work it out into subgroups like that.
00:12:45 --> 00:12:46 And whatever it is,
00:12:46 --> 00:12:47 each one of those leaders,
00:12:48 --> 00:12:49 each one of those groups has a leader.
00:12:50 --> 00:12:53 So Julie and I have worked in a youth group
00:12:53 --> 00:12:55 where we had two groups.
00:12:55 --> 00:12:59 I took the grade nine to 12 guys.
00:13:00 --> 00:13:01 Julie took the grade nine to 12 girls.
00:13:02 --> 00:13:03 But we've worked in other churches
00:13:03 --> 00:13:07 where we've had two leaders for every grade.
00:13:07 --> 00:13:08 We had a lot of kids.
00:13:08 --> 00:13:08 We had a lot of leaders.
00:13:09 --> 00:13:12 And so we break it up into that program.
00:13:12 --> 00:13:14 Now then we go a step further.
00:13:15 --> 00:13:17 And this is another relational structure
00:13:17 --> 00:13:18 that I think is very important.
00:13:19 --> 00:13:23 Whomever is the youth leader of the program,
00:13:23 --> 00:13:28 your job is to minister to the leadership team.
00:13:29 --> 00:13:33 That is your primary relational focus.
00:13:33 --> 00:13:35 That doesn't mean that you don't relate to kids,
00:13:36 --> 00:13:39 but your primary relationship is to the leaders.
00:13:40 --> 00:13:43 So one of the first things you've got to do at a church
00:13:43 --> 00:13:45 is say, who are my youth leaders?
00:13:46 --> 00:13:48 Or I've got to start to develop some youth leaders.
00:13:48 --> 00:13:54 And I want to pour my time, my love, my discipleship,
00:13:54 --> 00:13:57 and my Bible study into my youth leaders.
00:13:57 --> 00:14:03 These youth leaders minister to small groups.
00:14:04 --> 00:14:05 Nothing new there.
00:14:05 --> 00:14:07 This is where you guys excel.
00:14:07 --> 00:14:08 You're very good at this
00:14:08 --> 00:14:11 because you've learned this a lot.
00:14:12 --> 00:14:16 Now, I, the leader, am still part of a leadership team,
00:14:16 --> 00:14:17 and I run a small group.
00:14:18 --> 00:14:20 So keep that in mind.
00:14:20 --> 00:14:22 I, the youth leader, still am part of a leadership team
00:14:22 --> 00:14:23 and run a small group.
00:14:24 --> 00:14:27 And this set of small groups,
00:14:27 --> 00:14:29 they reach out to their family and friends.
00:14:31 --> 00:14:33 Now that means that me, the leader,
00:14:33 --> 00:14:35 sets the tone for the group.
00:14:36 --> 00:14:39 And I infuse the group with everything.
00:14:40 --> 00:14:43 And I, the leader, impact hundreds of people.
00:14:46 --> 00:14:47 So that takes a lot of work.
00:14:49 --> 00:14:50 And so I've got to think through a whole bunch of issues.
00:14:51 --> 00:14:53 One of the issues I've got to think through is,
00:14:54 --> 00:14:55 how do I minister to that group of people?
00:14:56 --> 00:14:57 How do I minister to that group of people?
00:14:58 --> 00:14:59 It's really hard.
00:14:59 --> 00:15:00 Because they're busy.
00:15:01 --> 00:15:01 They're gifted.
00:15:02 --> 00:15:04 They may be doing other things in the church.
00:15:04 --> 00:15:05 Yada, yada, yada.
00:15:06 --> 00:15:08 Now, what I've always suggested,
00:15:08 --> 00:15:09 I've written about it,
00:15:09 --> 00:15:11 and I strongly believe it.
00:15:11 --> 00:15:15 If you want to see that work,
00:15:16 --> 00:15:19 if you want to see a really effective youth ministry,
00:15:20 --> 00:15:22 one of the best things to do
00:15:22 --> 00:15:25 is to form a small group Bible study
00:15:25 --> 00:15:25 of that group of people.
00:15:26 --> 00:15:26 Right there.
00:15:28 --> 00:15:29 And so say to those people,
00:15:30 --> 00:15:33 next year, I want to ask you,
00:15:34 --> 00:15:35 and I don't want to force you,
00:15:35 --> 00:15:39 but I really want you to leave your cell group,
00:15:40 --> 00:15:42 and I want to form a cell group,
00:15:42 --> 00:15:43 a Bible study of leaders,
00:15:43 --> 00:15:45 where we're going to study the Bible
00:15:45 --> 00:15:47 and encourage each other
00:15:47 --> 00:15:50 with a specific focus on doing youth ministry.
00:15:50 --> 00:15:51 That will not be popular.
00:15:51 --> 00:15:52 Guarantee it.
00:15:52 --> 00:15:53 100%.
00:15:53 --> 00:15:54 It's never popular.
00:15:54 --> 00:15:56 But it will be very effective.
00:15:57 --> 00:15:58 And one of the things it will do
00:15:58 --> 00:16:01 is it will keep these people healthy
00:16:01 --> 00:16:02 in youth ministry.
00:16:03 --> 00:16:04 One of the things that many of us are finding
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06 is we have a constant turnover of youth leaders.
00:16:06 --> 00:16:08 There's a whole bunch of reasons for that.
00:16:08 --> 00:16:09 I think Friday nights,
00:16:10 --> 00:16:11 quite frankly, a culprit.
00:16:11 --> 00:16:13 What working person wants to go to youth group
00:16:13 --> 00:16:14 on a Friday night?
00:16:15 --> 00:16:15 Not many.
00:16:17 --> 00:16:19 And they just get tired.
00:16:20 --> 00:16:23 So I want to be ministering to this person,
00:16:24 --> 00:16:25 building them up.
00:16:26 --> 00:16:27 And so think through,
00:16:27 --> 00:16:29 could you as a leadership team
00:16:29 --> 00:16:31 leave your small groups,
00:16:31 --> 00:16:33 form your own small group,
00:16:33 --> 00:16:34 one of the things you could do
00:16:34 --> 00:16:38 is the Bible study that I give them,
00:16:38 --> 00:16:40 they then give them.
00:16:41 --> 00:16:41 You could do that.
00:16:42 --> 00:16:43 So that means that the Bible study of the leader
00:16:43 --> 00:16:45 doesn't need to do as much preparation.
00:16:45 --> 00:16:46 You know, not a lot of,
00:16:46 --> 00:16:48 most of us have done that a lot.
00:16:50 --> 00:16:53 Anybody have a question or a thought or comment on that?
00:16:57 --> 00:16:57 Yep?
00:16:57 --> 00:16:57 Okay.
00:16:57 --> 00:16:58 Okay.
00:16:58 --> 00:16:59 Now,
00:17:00 --> 00:17:01 the next thing we need to do,
00:17:02 --> 00:17:04 we've organized our youth group into small groups.
00:17:04 --> 00:17:06 So we've thought about relationships
00:17:06 --> 00:17:07 on an organizational level.
00:17:08 --> 00:17:09 Let's split up our youth group.
00:17:10 --> 00:17:11 I'm going to take these guys.
00:17:12 --> 00:17:14 Josh, you're going to take those guys.
00:17:14 --> 00:17:16 Julie, you're going to take those girls.
00:17:16 --> 00:17:18 Lonnie, you're going to take those girls, etc.
00:17:18 --> 00:17:19 By the way,
00:17:19 --> 00:17:21 there's a great evangelistic spin-off to that.
00:17:22 --> 00:17:24 Because a new kid walks in,
00:17:24 --> 00:17:26 and we know who to talk to that.
00:17:26 --> 00:17:28 It's really clear who talks to that kid.
00:17:29 --> 00:17:31 New kid, new kid, new kid.
00:17:31 --> 00:17:32 Woo!
00:17:32 --> 00:17:33 We have a new kid.
00:17:33 --> 00:17:34 This is awesome.
00:17:34 --> 00:17:35 Who talks to him?
00:17:36 --> 00:17:37 He's grade seven.
00:17:38 --> 00:17:38 He's mine.
00:17:39 --> 00:17:40 The kid is looked after.
00:17:41 --> 00:17:42 He's grade 12.
00:17:42 --> 00:17:43 Josh, he's yours.
00:17:44 --> 00:17:45 He's a girl.
00:17:45 --> 00:17:47 Julie, he's yours.
00:17:47 --> 00:17:50 I've actually done that.
00:17:51 --> 00:17:53 Mother brought their child to youth group years ago.
00:17:54 --> 00:17:55 And I'm looking at this child thinking,
00:17:55 --> 00:17:57 I don't know what you are.
00:17:59 --> 00:18:01 And so the mother said,
00:18:01 --> 00:18:04 my child, even the mother,
00:18:04 --> 00:18:06 my child is thinking about getting involved.
00:18:07 --> 00:18:09 And I thought, I'm making a call here.
00:18:09 --> 00:18:12 Bud, it's great to have you have a great set of Bible studies for guys.
00:18:13 --> 00:18:14 Grade 8 Bible studies.
00:18:14 --> 00:18:15 I'm a girl.
00:18:17 --> 00:18:24 Now I want to think,
00:18:25 --> 00:18:25 I want to think,
00:18:26 --> 00:18:27 okay, organizationally,
00:18:27 --> 00:18:28 I've got a small group thing going.
00:18:30 --> 00:18:32 In that small group,
00:18:32 --> 00:18:33 we're going to study the Bible,
00:18:33 --> 00:18:34 we're going to hang out,
00:18:34 --> 00:18:35 we're going to get to know each other,
00:18:36 --> 00:18:36 all that good stuff.
00:18:37 --> 00:18:38 Many of you have done this.
00:18:38 --> 00:18:40 I don't need to spend a minute on it.
00:18:40 --> 00:18:45 But then there's going to be other stuff that comes out.
00:18:45 --> 00:18:49 And so I want to develop this kind of culture,
00:18:49 --> 00:18:52 where from the small group,
00:18:52 --> 00:18:55 I go out to coffee with my guys.
00:18:55 --> 00:18:57 Or I go to McDonald's.
00:18:58 --> 00:18:58 Or whatever.
00:18:58 --> 00:18:59 Whatever it is.
00:18:59 --> 00:19:07 And so those guys know that the relationship just isn't about me teaching the word to them.
00:19:08 --> 00:19:11 But there's also a much broader category.
00:19:11 --> 00:19:15 And so I'm going to have a whole bunch of aspects that I'm going to deal with.
00:19:15 --> 00:19:16 All these things.
00:19:17 --> 00:19:19 So kids are going to need pastoral care.
00:19:20 --> 00:19:22 My parents are getting a divorce.
00:19:22 --> 00:19:25 We'll come to Bible study and we'll do a study on divorce.
00:19:27 --> 00:19:27 Well, yeah.
00:19:28 --> 00:19:30 But also, let's go talk about it, bro.
00:19:30 --> 00:19:31 God, it's terrible.
00:19:31 --> 00:19:31 Let's go.
00:19:32 --> 00:19:33 Can I meet you at McDonald's?
00:19:33 --> 00:19:34 When can I meet you at McDonald's?
00:19:34 --> 00:19:38 Why don't we meet for three weeks and talk this through?
00:19:38 --> 00:19:40 Would it be helpful if I called one of your parents?
00:19:40 --> 00:19:41 Is there something I can do?
00:19:41 --> 00:19:44 This kid needs to know that I not only share the gospel,
00:19:44 --> 00:19:45 but I share my lives as well.
00:19:45 --> 00:19:51 So relationship building, discipleship, mentoring, answering questions,
00:19:51 --> 00:19:55 all these things are going to come about relationally.
00:19:56 --> 00:19:59 Now, this is hard work and it's expensive.
00:20:00 --> 00:20:05 It costs our time and it costs our money and it costs our effort.
00:20:06 --> 00:20:08 So every church I've worked at, I've said,
00:20:08 --> 00:20:11 listen, I'm going to need money to spend time with kids.
00:20:11 --> 00:20:18 So I'm going to, in Vancouver, I'm going to need Starbucks cards.
00:20:18 --> 00:20:23 And so the church factored in and we spent thousands of dollars every year
00:20:23 --> 00:20:24 taking youth to Starbucks.
00:20:25 --> 00:20:30 So Josh was one of my youth leaders and all the time I'm giving Josh a Starbucks card.
00:20:30 --> 00:20:34 Josh would send me an email and he'd say, I'm running out of Starbucks and I'm thinking,
00:20:34 --> 00:20:35 Josh, that's awesome.
00:20:36 --> 00:20:40 That means he's taking his guys in Bible study out for coffee,
00:20:40 --> 00:20:44 talking with them, loving them, giving them advice, opening the Bible with them.
00:20:45 --> 00:20:46 And Josh is saying, I'm running low.
00:20:47 --> 00:20:47 Bang.
00:20:47 --> 00:20:49 So I give him another Starbucks card.
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51 And I'm thinking, this is great.
00:20:51 --> 00:20:54 All these relationships starting to form.
00:20:54 --> 00:20:55 Julie, you got any comments on that?
00:20:56 --> 00:20:56 No?
00:20:57 --> 00:21:00 Anybody got a question or a thought on this issue?
00:21:00 --> 00:21:01 Yeah, yeah.
00:21:01 --> 00:21:01 Yeah.
00:21:05 --> 00:21:05 Yeah.
00:21:07 --> 00:21:09 Yeah, that's a very good question.
00:21:12 --> 00:21:16 Certainly if I say to a year seven boy, would you like to go, they're going to freak out.
00:21:17 --> 00:21:17 I'm going to freak out.
00:21:21 --> 00:21:30 Roughly for guys, grade 10, year 10, year 11, usually in pairs, you know.
00:21:32 --> 00:21:34 Usually they don't get it.
00:21:35 --> 00:21:38 And then once you do it, they crave it.
00:21:38 --> 00:21:40 So there's a little bit of a hurdle to get over.
00:21:42 --> 00:21:49 But that's where usually this stuff, this type of getting to know kids doesn't come from youth group.
00:21:49 --> 00:21:50 It comes from small group.
00:21:51 --> 00:21:54 So if I were to walk up to a kid in youth group and say, hey, you know, it's really good having you here.
00:21:55 --> 00:21:56 We've sort of gotten to get to know each other.
00:21:56 --> 00:21:57 Let's have coffee.
00:21:58 --> 00:22:02 That's a little bit odder than Jono, who's in my small group.
00:22:02 --> 00:22:03 He's been coming to small group for a year.
00:22:04 --> 00:22:05 Really loves small group.
00:22:05 --> 00:22:07 Obviously, it's a much more natural setting.
00:22:07 --> 00:22:12 So I would argue this kind of stuff springs more from the small group.
00:22:13 --> 00:22:14 Julie, girls, what are you doing?
00:22:14 --> 00:22:15 How old are you, you know?
00:22:15 --> 00:22:19 Yeah, you know, girls, I think girls do this at a younger age.
00:22:20 --> 00:22:24 But I remember when I was at Oakhurst, I was saying to other girls, let's go out for coffee.
00:22:24 --> 00:22:25 She's like, really?
00:22:26 --> 00:22:27 What are you doing now?
00:22:27 --> 00:22:28 And do I have coffee?
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30 And it was just so foreign to her.
00:22:31 --> 00:22:40 And one thing I will comment on is what happens out of this, if this becomes a culture of your group, is the kids start to do it with each other.
00:22:40 --> 00:22:52 And I had a group of girls in Vancouver, and they met together every week of the last week of the week, and they did socialise outside of that.
00:22:52 --> 00:22:53 They had other friends.
00:22:54 --> 00:22:57 And so I said to them, okay, so I didn't name them.
00:22:57 --> 00:23:01 I go, okay, this week, Katrina, you're going to have coffee with Vanessa.
00:23:02 --> 00:23:06 You've got a week to see each other, and I'll ask you next week, did you actually see each other?
00:23:06 --> 00:23:08 And they actually got in the habit.
00:23:09 --> 00:23:11 They did it, so I didn't have their kids tell them how to do it.
00:23:11 --> 00:23:19 But that culture developed so that the kids started to see, this is what the leaders do with us, and now this is what we do with intelligence.
00:23:19 --> 00:23:26 So if one of them comes to you through, and they say, I'm really upset, the kids' automatic response was, well, let's get together coffee this week.
00:23:26 --> 00:23:27 And they got into that habit.
00:23:27 --> 00:23:30 So the flow on was past leader and kid.
00:23:31 --> 00:23:32 Yeah, good, good.
00:23:33 --> 00:23:34 Yeah, yeah.
00:23:34 --> 00:23:38 Now, the other thing we would do in small group, again, nothing new here.
00:23:39 --> 00:23:45 You guys have been doing this forever, is our small group Bible studies met Friday afternoon in Vancouver.
00:23:45 --> 00:23:46 It was a good time.
00:23:48 --> 00:23:52 In other churches, I think we met Wednesday afternoon at Oakhurst.
00:23:52 --> 00:23:53 That was a good time.
00:23:53 --> 00:23:54 We would often hang out afterward.
00:23:55 --> 00:24:01 So we would have our Bible study and stuff, and then we'd say, you know, this is going to be a night where we go to Maccas or hang out.
00:24:02 --> 00:24:03 In Vancouver, we'd hang out a lot.
00:24:03 --> 00:24:14 My Bible study and I, the older they got, come grade 12, Bible study went from 5 to 7, and then we hung out almost every Friday night from 7 to whenever and did whatever.
00:24:15 --> 00:24:15 Yeah?
00:24:16 --> 00:24:19 How do you do this for the other kids that, obviously, you don't take them out for coffee?
00:24:19 --> 00:24:20 Yeah.
00:24:20 --> 00:24:20 Yeah.
00:24:20 --> 00:24:21 All right.
00:24:21 --> 00:24:23 Obviously, they still need to be the ability to ride.
00:24:24 --> 00:24:24 Yeah.
00:24:25 --> 00:24:25 Good question.
00:24:27 --> 00:24:31 I think I'm going to go the classic pack activity.
00:24:31 --> 00:24:41 So if we've broken up our group into subgroups, I'm going to say, okay, subgroup, we're going to regularly do stuff.
00:24:41 --> 00:24:46 And this is the time when you let off steam, have a fun activity.
00:24:46 --> 00:24:48 That's the beautiful setting for it.
00:24:48 --> 00:24:49 We're going to go bowling.
00:24:49 --> 00:24:50 We're going to do this.
00:24:50 --> 00:24:50 We're going to do that.
00:24:51 --> 00:24:54 And it stems from our life together.
00:24:55 --> 00:24:56 It stems from the gospel.
00:24:56 --> 00:24:58 And now we're going to spend our lives with each other.
00:24:58 --> 00:25:06 And then as you get a little older, we'll move into a little bit more heavy one-on-one, just chatting about life.
00:25:06 --> 00:25:09 But with my grade 7 small group, gosh, we played cricket.
00:25:11 --> 00:25:12 We'd go on hikes together.
00:25:13 --> 00:25:14 We'd have movie nights.
00:25:17 --> 00:25:17 Great fun.
00:25:20 --> 00:25:21 Yeah.
00:25:21 --> 00:25:22 Anybody else got a quick?
00:25:22 --> 00:25:22 Yeah.
00:25:22 --> 00:25:22 Yeah.
00:25:22 --> 00:25:22 Yeah.
00:25:22 --> 00:25:25 I was just going to bring you up going back to Jason.
00:25:25 --> 00:25:30 What age would you say for many of the girls that that kind of thing would start?
00:25:32 --> 00:25:32 What age?
00:25:33 --> 00:25:33 You know what?
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36 I'd say the same thing for girls.
00:25:36 --> 00:25:39 You can do it younger and they respond better.
00:25:39 --> 00:25:42 Because girls are much more engaged in conversation.
00:25:42 --> 00:25:47 And girls are not threatened to sit across the table and look at each other in the dialogue.
00:25:47 --> 00:25:50 Whereas boys, it's a lot harder to think.
00:25:50 --> 00:25:53 Let's have an intense conversation for ages every morning.
00:25:53 --> 00:25:55 And so girls are much more...
00:25:55 --> 00:25:57 You know, partly it's...
00:25:57 --> 00:25:59 I would certainly start with a grade 9-up.
00:26:00 --> 00:26:02 But I've worked at it earlier.
00:26:03 --> 00:26:05 And so one of the things I did with a young group once was I said to them,
00:26:05 --> 00:26:09 I want to get together with you outside of a new group.
00:26:09 --> 00:26:12 So I want to get into a pair with someone that you'd like to do something with.
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 And then the pair of you come to me and say,
00:26:15 --> 00:26:17 what do you want to do for the three of us?
00:26:17 --> 00:26:20 So one of them might come and say, we'll go to a new group.
00:26:20 --> 00:26:26 One pair said, we want to start in the morning and see how long we can do a roadies and do it all day.
00:26:28 --> 00:26:29 Great.
00:26:29 --> 00:26:30 So...
00:26:30 --> 00:26:32 So...
00:26:32 --> 00:26:33 So...
00:26:33 --> 00:26:34 So...
00:26:34 --> 00:26:35 So...
00:26:35 --> 00:26:40 That whole idea of, you feel safe and secure because it's not as intense.
00:26:40 --> 00:26:41 But yeah, earlier with the group.
00:26:41 --> 00:26:42 Yeah.
00:26:43 --> 00:26:45 Now again, I want to...
00:26:45 --> 00:26:47 If I'm overworking the concept, sorry.
00:26:47 --> 00:26:52 But I want you to see that this stuff comes out of being the Christian community.
00:26:52 --> 00:26:58 So when we were at St. Ives, just up the road, heavy study pressure community.
00:26:58 --> 00:26:59 So we would have study halls.
00:27:00 --> 00:27:02 We would say, this is clearly a good thing for youth.
00:27:02 --> 00:27:04 Was it designed to attract non-Christians?
00:27:04 --> 00:27:05 No.
00:27:05 --> 00:27:08 Was it bring your friend to study hall and then we're going to tell them about Jesus?
00:27:09 --> 00:27:09 No.
00:27:10 --> 00:27:11 Did non-Christians come?
00:27:11 --> 00:27:12 Yes, they did.
00:27:13 --> 00:27:14 In droves.
00:27:14 --> 00:27:16 But that's not what it was designed for.
00:27:16 --> 00:27:20 But it was, hey, we as a community can see a perceived need here.
00:27:20 --> 00:27:22 This is serious need.
00:27:22 --> 00:27:24 And so then we started to have a study camp.
00:27:24 --> 00:27:27 You know, you guys, the city's been running study camps as long as the hills.
00:27:28 --> 00:27:29 It was awesome.
00:27:29 --> 00:27:36 It was doing life together that springs from this kind of being God's people
00:27:36 --> 00:27:39 and doing it in a way that's culturally appropriate.
00:27:40 --> 00:27:42 Now, I'm going to make a couple more comments.
00:27:42 --> 00:27:43 Anybody else have a thought or statement or question?
00:27:43 --> 00:27:44 I'll answer that again.
00:27:44 --> 00:27:44 Yeah.
00:27:45 --> 00:27:48 With study hall, I actually had my father study.
00:27:48 --> 00:27:49 He was going to go to the first time.
00:27:49 --> 00:27:50 I said, come over to my house on Saturday.
00:27:50 --> 00:27:52 I'm going to make you study.
00:27:52 --> 00:27:53 And I wanted to learn.
00:27:54 --> 00:27:56 And they have a day of just studying together.
00:27:56 --> 00:27:57 That was really cool.
00:27:57 --> 00:27:59 Whereas in Vancouver, that just,
00:28:00 --> 00:28:00 Oh, Chris, we never did it.
00:28:01 --> 00:28:02 It was not an issue.
00:28:03 --> 00:28:06 Vancouver, you know,
00:28:06 --> 00:28:07 if we'd have said, hey, we're going to have a study hall,
00:28:07 --> 00:28:08 they'd be like, why?
00:28:08 --> 00:28:09 You know?
00:28:09 --> 00:28:09 We're Canadians.
00:28:10 --> 00:28:12 We're just going to dig oil out of the ground.
00:28:13 --> 00:28:14 Club seals.
00:28:16 --> 00:28:17 Yeah.
00:28:20 --> 00:28:25 You have a great Australian accent, by the way, bro.
00:28:25 --> 00:28:26 That's awesome.
00:28:26 --> 00:28:28 I love it.
00:28:28 --> 00:28:29 I'm from down south.
00:28:30 --> 00:28:33 So, taking time, spending money, and effort.
00:28:34 --> 00:28:36 If you've got youth leaders that aren't on board with you,
00:28:36 --> 00:28:37 it's problematic.
00:28:37 --> 00:28:38 Problematic.
00:28:38 --> 00:28:39 How do you deal with that?
00:28:39 --> 00:28:39 Yeah.
00:28:39 --> 00:28:40 Because we've got,
00:28:40 --> 00:28:41 we want to talk to this year,
00:28:41 --> 00:28:43 but we're in a team of 13.
00:28:43 --> 00:28:43 Yeah.
00:28:44 --> 00:28:44 Yeah.
00:28:44 --> 00:28:45 So, we go back and say,
00:28:45 --> 00:28:46 hey, guys, this is awesome.
00:28:46 --> 00:28:47 Let's do it.
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49 Yeah, dude, that's really hard.
00:28:49 --> 00:28:56 I'll tell you something you already know.
00:28:56 --> 00:29:00 That in the Bible, leadership is about character.
00:29:01 --> 00:29:02 And it's about godly character.
00:29:03 --> 00:29:06 Titus chapter 1, 1 Timothy chapter 3,
00:29:07 --> 00:29:10 it's really clear what God says to us.
00:29:10 --> 00:29:13 It's who you are as a godly person.
00:29:13 --> 00:29:15 That's what makes you a leader.
00:29:16 --> 00:29:18 And I then want to take a step further and say,
00:29:18 --> 00:29:21 godly leader,
00:29:21 --> 00:29:23 you need to be committed to a godly program.
00:29:23 --> 00:29:26 And this is where youth leaders often say no.
00:29:26 --> 00:29:28 Now, they don't actually say no,
00:29:28 --> 00:29:29 but they do say no.
00:29:29 --> 00:29:31 They say, I want to be leader
00:29:31 --> 00:29:32 for all sorts of other reasons.
00:29:33 --> 00:29:36 It was expected, or it's trendy,
00:29:36 --> 00:29:38 or it's attractive, or whatever.
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41 And I want to be doing these certain types of activities.
00:29:42 --> 00:29:44 And that, there's no way around it,
00:29:44 --> 00:29:47 but teaching, spending time with them,
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49 wooing them, talking with them,
00:29:49 --> 00:29:50 and then cutting them off.
00:29:51 --> 00:29:55 And saying, we've run the games thing,
00:29:55 --> 00:29:56 and it's just not working.
00:29:56 --> 00:29:57 It hasn't worked for us.
00:29:58 --> 00:29:58 Come on.
00:29:59 --> 00:30:01 And the Bible's clear on what it says.
00:30:01 --> 00:30:04 Please run a small group where you actually study the Bible
00:30:04 --> 00:30:06 with these guys or girls,
00:30:06 --> 00:30:07 and love on them,
00:30:07 --> 00:30:10 and just get the joy from that,
00:30:10 --> 00:30:12 not from doing some other activities.
00:30:13 --> 00:30:14 And a lot of leaders,
00:30:14 --> 00:30:15 a lot of parents,
00:30:15 --> 00:30:16 a lot of ministers,
00:30:17 --> 00:30:18 that's not what they want.
00:30:20 --> 00:30:23 It's about lots of other things.
00:30:23 --> 00:30:24 Generally, it's about numbers.
00:30:24 --> 00:30:24 Yeah, Cameron.
00:30:24 --> 00:30:27 I had a similar situation there,
00:30:28 --> 00:30:31 and I took my leads away on weekend retreat.
00:30:32 --> 00:30:35 And thankfully, it was a great spot.
00:30:36 --> 00:30:38 It was in the middle of an estate forest.
00:30:38 --> 00:30:40 There was no mobile phone coverage.
00:30:40 --> 00:30:42 There was a generator power.
00:30:42 --> 00:30:44 So there was...
00:30:44 --> 00:30:44 But it was just,
00:30:45 --> 00:30:46 hey, let's see what we're...
00:30:46 --> 00:30:48 Let's look at...
00:30:48 --> 00:30:52 You know, I used some of the Mike Yacquanelli stuff,
00:30:52 --> 00:30:55 and Ken's actually written a full page response,
00:30:55 --> 00:30:57 up-page response to Mike's thing.
00:30:58 --> 00:30:58 Sat down,
00:30:58 --> 00:31:00 look, this is where they've been,
00:31:00 --> 00:31:01 this is where they've gone,
00:31:02 --> 00:31:03 this is where it hasn't happened.
00:31:04 --> 00:31:06 God, then, to spend some time with the word.
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09 And you put them in a place where
00:31:09 --> 00:31:11 you've got no distractions,
00:31:11 --> 00:31:12 and they've got to look at it.
00:31:13 --> 00:31:15 And then you come out of it,
00:31:15 --> 00:31:16 I lost half the group.
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18 But the other half...
00:31:20 --> 00:31:21 got it.
00:31:21 --> 00:31:24 and started the world with it.
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27 So that's hard work.
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29 And I think what Ken was saying before,
00:31:29 --> 00:31:30 you have your,
00:31:30 --> 00:31:34 if I was a group of leaders,
00:31:34 --> 00:31:36 that's where you win them.
00:31:37 --> 00:31:38 The long term,
00:31:38 --> 00:31:39 where you win them, where you are.
00:31:39 --> 00:31:41 And the best leaders
00:31:41 --> 00:31:43 are the ones that you yourself have grown.
00:31:44 --> 00:31:46 So that's going to be an organic solution
00:31:46 --> 00:31:46 to your problem,
00:31:46 --> 00:31:51 is if I come in as youth leader,
00:31:51 --> 00:31:53 one of the groups
00:31:53 --> 00:31:54 that I'm going to target strategically
00:31:54 --> 00:31:56 in my small group is,
00:31:56 --> 00:31:59 are there any grade 10 or 11
00:31:59 --> 00:32:01 or maybe grade 12 boys?
00:32:01 --> 00:32:01 Quite often,
00:32:01 --> 00:32:03 the grade 12ers don't accept the new guy
00:32:03 --> 00:32:04 because I'm not like the old guy.
00:32:05 --> 00:32:07 But I want to take an older group of guys,
00:32:07 --> 00:32:09 and I want Julie
00:32:09 --> 00:32:10 to take the older group of girls
00:32:10 --> 00:32:12 because within a year or two,
00:32:12 --> 00:32:13 they're obviously going to grow up,
00:32:13 --> 00:32:14 go to university,
00:32:14 --> 00:32:16 and they will be leaders
00:32:16 --> 00:32:17 who think like me.
00:32:18 --> 00:32:21 And that's the best way.
00:32:21 --> 00:32:22 It's just to fight.
00:32:22 --> 00:32:23 If you have to fight with your leaders,
00:32:23 --> 00:32:24 fight with your leaders,
00:32:24 --> 00:32:26 but then just start producing these.
00:32:27 --> 00:32:28 Organic leaders.
00:32:28 --> 00:32:30 And this is the best conversation
00:32:30 --> 00:32:31 if you could ever have it.
00:32:31 --> 00:32:32 Hey, listen,
00:32:32 --> 00:32:33 I want you to think about becoming a leader.
00:32:34 --> 00:32:35 Oh, me?
00:32:35 --> 00:32:35 Ow.
00:32:36 --> 00:32:36 What do I do?
00:32:37 --> 00:32:39 You just do to them
00:32:39 --> 00:32:41 what I did to you.
00:32:42 --> 00:32:43 That's it?
00:32:44 --> 00:32:45 That's it.
00:32:45 --> 00:32:47 If you can have that conversation,
00:32:47 --> 00:32:48 bang.
00:32:48 --> 00:32:50 And so they just say,
00:32:50 --> 00:32:51 wow, okay.
00:32:51 --> 00:32:52 And they run a small group,
00:32:53 --> 00:32:54 just like you've run a small group with them,
00:32:54 --> 00:32:56 and hopefully the same thing happens,
00:32:56 --> 00:32:58 and then you start to get this nice,
00:32:58 --> 00:33:00 organic flow of leaders.
00:33:00 --> 00:33:01 But do change it.
00:33:01 --> 00:33:03 If I'm hearing your question rightly,
00:33:03 --> 00:33:03 and I hope I am,
00:33:04 --> 00:33:06 changing things is hard.
00:33:06 --> 00:33:07 Ugh.
00:33:07 --> 00:33:08 Brutal.
00:33:09 --> 00:33:10 Now I saw another hand,
00:33:10 --> 00:33:11 I thought, somewhere.
00:33:11 --> 00:33:11 Yep.
00:33:12 --> 00:33:12 I have a question.
00:33:12 --> 00:33:13 Yeah.
00:33:13 --> 00:33:14 Do you have any advice for us?
00:33:15 --> 00:33:16 We lost out using this at the beginning of India.
00:33:17 --> 00:33:19 How can we as a group of leaders
00:33:19 --> 00:33:21 without that head from the diagram
00:33:21 --> 00:33:22 and everything else
00:33:22 --> 00:33:25 try and keep the stuff that we want
00:33:25 --> 00:33:27 that can have a great system?
00:33:27 --> 00:33:30 How do we do that without that person?
00:33:31 --> 00:33:33 Is there a search for a new youth leader?
00:33:33 --> 00:33:34 Is that like happening?
00:33:35 --> 00:33:35 Yeah.
00:33:35 --> 00:33:36 Yeah.
00:33:36 --> 00:33:36 It kind of.
00:33:37 --> 00:33:38 It might be the youth.
00:33:38 --> 00:33:39 We're all in a Bible study together.
00:33:39 --> 00:33:40 Yeah.
00:33:42 --> 00:33:43 Yeah, it's really hard.
00:33:43 --> 00:33:44 It's, it's, it's,
00:33:45 --> 00:33:45 that,
00:33:45 --> 00:33:46 we all know that that,
00:33:47 --> 00:33:48 it's the central minister,
00:33:48 --> 00:33:49 the central youth leader,
00:33:49 --> 00:33:51 so important, you know?
00:33:51 --> 00:33:51 It just,
00:33:52 --> 00:33:53 they keep the,
00:33:53 --> 00:33:54 they keep the glue together,
00:33:54 --> 00:33:55 they keep us motivated,
00:33:55 --> 00:33:57 they keep us moving in the same direction.
00:33:58 --> 00:33:59 They,
00:33:59 --> 00:34:01 they do work that makes our life easier for us.
00:34:03 --> 00:34:03 You guys,
00:34:03 --> 00:34:04 sorry,
00:34:04 --> 00:34:04 you girls?
00:34:04 --> 00:34:05 Is it just girls?
00:34:05 --> 00:34:05 You,
00:34:06 --> 00:34:06 you,
00:34:06 --> 00:34:06 you,
00:34:06 --> 00:34:07 you people.
00:34:08 --> 00:34:08 Okay,
00:34:08 --> 00:34:09 you people.
00:34:10 --> 00:34:11 Anybody know George Stathios?
00:34:12 --> 00:34:13 Is that a name you guys know?
00:34:13 --> 00:34:13 Do I know there's a,
00:34:14 --> 00:34:14 George Stathios,
00:34:14 --> 00:34:14 good,
00:34:14 --> 00:34:15 good buddy of mine.
00:34:15 --> 00:34:15 He's awesome.
00:34:15 --> 00:34:16 Awesome.
00:34:16 --> 00:34:17 He got married.
00:34:17 --> 00:34:19 He got married on January 1st,
00:34:19 --> 00:34:20 2001.
00:34:22 --> 00:34:23 That's George Stathios.
00:34:23 --> 00:34:24 It was in 2000.
00:34:25 --> 00:34:26 It was after Y2K.
00:34:27 --> 00:34:27 And,
00:34:27 --> 00:34:29 the minister who led us,
00:34:29 --> 00:34:30 such a great minister,
00:34:31 --> 00:34:32 but I thought it was Mayor Quimby from the Simpsons.
00:34:33 --> 00:34:35 We're at the wedding today,
00:34:35 --> 00:34:36 and Julie Lentow,
00:34:36 --> 00:34:38 she's Mayor Quimby from the Simpsons.
00:34:38 --> 00:34:39 And so,
00:34:39 --> 00:34:39 for all during the wedding,
00:34:40 --> 00:34:40 we're going,
00:34:40 --> 00:34:41 you people,
00:34:41 --> 00:34:41 if you know Simpsons,
00:34:42 --> 00:34:43 oh,
00:34:43 --> 00:34:43 sorry,
00:34:44 --> 00:34:45 I'm being taped.
00:34:48 --> 00:34:48 And it,
00:34:49 --> 00:34:50 Steve,
00:34:50 --> 00:34:52 why did you say those things about George Stathios?
00:34:52 --> 00:34:52 Y'all,
00:34:52 --> 00:34:53 I can't even forget that.
00:34:55 --> 00:35:00 Let me think about your question.
00:35:02 --> 00:35:06 I don't want to give a trite answer to a deep question.
00:35:08 --> 00:35:10 Let me think about it,
00:35:10 --> 00:35:12 and I will say something after lunch about it.
00:35:14 --> 00:35:14 Okay,
00:35:14 --> 00:35:15 let me make some last comments,
00:35:15 --> 00:35:16 and let's take a lunch break.
00:35:16 --> 00:35:21 Now have a think about your youth group.
00:35:22 --> 00:35:24 And this is actually going to be a frustrating answer.
00:35:25 --> 00:35:25 Sorry,
00:35:25 --> 00:35:28 this is going to be a frustrating next set of comments,
00:35:28 --> 00:35:30 given your situation without a leader.
00:35:30 --> 00:35:34 But you now have a whole bunch of things to think through
00:35:34 --> 00:35:36 that are going to take time.
00:35:36 --> 00:35:40 So you're going to have to think about doing Christian activities.
00:35:40 --> 00:35:41 Well,
00:35:41 --> 00:35:42 that's actually a hard thing to do,
00:35:42 --> 00:35:44 because we haven't been taught to do it.
00:35:45 --> 00:35:46 I'm going to tell you this afternoon,
00:35:46 --> 00:35:47 we've been taught to sing,
00:35:48 --> 00:35:49 to pray maybe,
00:35:49 --> 00:35:50 to Bible study,
00:35:51 --> 00:35:52 and to play games.
00:35:52 --> 00:35:54 That's kind of all we've been taught how to do.
00:35:54 --> 00:35:55 And I'm going to say,
00:35:55 --> 00:35:55 no,
00:35:55 --> 00:35:58 let's do a whole bunch of other activities in the youth group meeting.
00:35:58 --> 00:35:58 Oh,
00:35:58 --> 00:35:59 that's going to take time.
00:36:01 --> 00:36:03 We're going to have to think about how we do this in culture.
00:36:03 --> 00:36:04 How do I communicate?
00:36:05 --> 00:36:06 That's going to take time.
00:36:07 --> 00:36:09 I'm going to need to spend time with leaders.
00:36:09 --> 00:36:10 That's going to take time.
00:36:11 --> 00:36:15 I'm going to need to spend time with youth outside of youth group.
00:36:15 --> 00:36:16 That's going to take time.
00:36:17 --> 00:36:19 So that means you're going to have to think about
00:36:19 --> 00:36:22 maybe cutting out some other activities.
00:36:23 --> 00:36:27 And I think there are lots of activities in youth ministry that we do
00:36:27 --> 00:36:29 that maybe we need to cut out.
00:36:30 --> 00:36:31 That maybe we need to say,
00:36:31 --> 00:36:31 gosh,
00:36:31 --> 00:36:34 I'm spending 10 to 20 hours a week on that,
00:36:34 --> 00:36:36 and it's not producing a lot of fruit.
00:36:36 --> 00:36:39 But I know that if I spend time with my leaders,
00:36:39 --> 00:36:41 or if I spend time with youth,
00:36:41 --> 00:36:43 or I think creatively about my teaching,
00:36:44 --> 00:36:45 that will pay fruit.
00:36:45 --> 00:36:47 So each one of us is in a different situation.
00:36:47 --> 00:36:49 So you're going to have to think through what we drop out.
00:36:50 --> 00:36:52 What we drop out.
00:36:52 --> 00:36:54 What we drop out.
00:36:55 --> 00:36:56 Anybody got a last comment or question?
00:36:56 --> 00:36:57 I'm just warning you,
00:36:57 --> 00:36:57 if you do,
00:36:58 --> 00:37:00 it means we're going to go to lunch later.