Episode 265: From Rebellion to Redemption, A Testimony of Christ’s Power in the Arab World: Maged Atalla

[00:00:02] I So Jesus in my dreams And I recognized him, shiny face, huge figure, and once I recognized him,

[00:00:15] I turned and wanted to run away. When I started running away from him, for some reason I felt that his hand landed on my back.

[00:00:25] In fact, I shake when I heard him about these moments. And I turned my face towards him and he said,

[00:00:35] Don't scared. You belong to me.

[00:00:45] When welcome to Candid, where we never settle for less than the truth, I'm your host, Dr. Jonathan Youssef.

[00:00:51] Each week we'll tackle tough issues and answer your hard questions and take a candid look at the Christian faith.

[00:00:59] Well, today I have a very special friend. I think we have known each other maybe 25 years

[00:01:07] Because I came and visited your family, your little family in Monte Carlo when you were recording with that.

[00:01:14] But my guest today is Mr. Magga de Talla.

[00:01:18] And, Magga is the international director of leading the way.

[00:01:23] And he's worn countless hats, ministering and working here with the ministry. He's a fellow Egyptian.

[00:01:33] And he's got a wonderful story. He's going to share with us today.

[00:01:37] Magga, welcome to Candid Conversations.

[00:01:39] Thank you very much for having me, Jonathan. It's a privilege and honor to be with you.

[00:01:43] I also be with your listeners. I believe there are many and I am one of them.

[00:01:49] Good. Well, we need more. That's why we're having you on.

[00:01:54] We're going to boost our ratings immediately.

[00:01:57] Everyone will say quickly, go and download that episode and listen to Magga de Talla.

[00:02:02] But I think let's see. Let's just do a little snapshot of our history together.

[00:02:08] And then I want you to share your own story of journey of faith.

[00:02:13] So Dad was recording the dual language material through Transworld Radio with Baki Satecha.

[00:02:21] What year was this?

[00:02:23] In fact, 1996, the promikilusif walked into my studio in Monte Carlo.

[00:02:30] I never so him before and I have never heard of him.

[00:02:35] I read one of the books. Back then that was written by Baki Satecha.

[00:02:40] But at that time, I learned that Dr. Mike was the author of the book,

[00:02:46] leadership style of Jesus and Baki Satecha translated it.

[00:02:51] Late Baki Satecha was an amazing person, pastor. He was my mentor and a huge figure in the Egyptian context.

[00:03:00] Then I got to know Dr. Mike Lusif for many years after that, 1996 and on.

[00:03:09] He used to come with Reverend Baki Satecha almost twice a year.

[00:03:14] I used to imprison them.

[00:03:16] Yes, I remember the studio was a tiny little, not quite as spacious as what we've got here but tiny little.

[00:03:23] In the midst of Southern France.

[00:03:25] I remember Dr. Mike when he walks in the booth and says,

[00:03:29] I feel that I'm getting into the furnace.

[00:03:33] Was there an air conditioner in there?

[00:03:35] You had to turn it off because of the sound quality.

[00:03:38] You got to try.

[00:03:40] Dr. Mike used to tell me,

[00:03:43] my brain boils after five minutes.

[00:03:47] We had to turn it off because of the old technology.

[00:03:51] But most of the time, after that we could fix it.

[00:03:54] But it was a challenge.

[00:03:56] Those were the hard days of getting a professional quality sound out.

[00:04:01] I knew the quality of the man Mike Lusif when he was dedicated to achieving this big goal.

[00:04:08] Recording the message, it was not the best experience ever for anybody.

[00:04:13] But he was focusing on doing this because of a calling.

[00:04:19] I learned how to dedicate it.

[00:04:22] You need to do anything.

[00:04:25] Back then, you and Joshua came to come to Monte Carlo and also some of the family with Elizabeth.

[00:04:32] Of course, I'm the sweet lady.

[00:04:35] I had the privilege to know all of you and I had some business meetings.

[00:04:40] We recorded many, many programs over the years.

[00:04:43] I can tell you that we recorded 520 episodes of Mike Lusif's content.

[00:04:51] And I had the privilege to sit and edit these programs for hours.

[00:04:57] I would say, I'm the first listener of Dr. Mike Lusif.

[00:05:00] You were the only listener at the moment.

[00:05:03] So just for people who don't know because I know that's especially through the podcast.

[00:05:08] We don't talk a lot about all of the different intricacies of what leading the way does.

[00:05:12] So this was really, we were on domestic radio in the United States, which was dead teaching from Church of the Apostles.

[00:05:19] And this was really one of the first sort of beach heads into the international community outside of his speaking engagements.

[00:05:28] But really getting on a global impact through radio.

[00:05:32] Tell us a little bit about trans-world radio.

[00:05:35] Maybe a little bit about the Monte Carlo station and all the history there,

[00:05:41] and the dual language content.

[00:05:43] To tell you that to Ruth Jonathan, I was in Monte Carlo 1995 for recordings.

[00:05:50] I was recording for another ministry.

[00:05:52] And then they told me about potential dual language programming.

[00:05:58] That trans-world radio is planning to investigate to see if it's good for the Arabic broadcast from Monte Carlo.

[00:06:05] To the Arab world.

[00:06:08] And there's just to give you an idea about what's going on.

[00:06:12] The broadcast from Monte Carlo is on two main stations, and I'm not revealing secrets here.

[00:06:18] The station was built in Monte Carlo up hill on Montagell.

[00:06:24] The station was built by Hitler himself.

[00:06:27] And he meant to send out his propaganda to his troops.

[00:06:31] So he was in Alameen and Northern Africa.

[00:06:37] And he finished the building that they committed suicide without broadcasting one day of his Nazi propaganda.

[00:06:48] Inside the radio tower there's lots of globes of the world because of the concept of taking the Nazi regime and conquering the world.

[00:06:59] But what ended up being used for was exactly that.

[00:07:01] Absolutely, I mean that was the concept and he wants to conquer the world.

[00:07:06] Global domination, global domination everywhere.

[00:07:10] And not even for a day the broadcast over everywhere.

[00:07:14] So if you use later, the station will stick in over by Radio France and Tarnasional, the French radio broadcast.

[00:07:23] And Transworld Radio, I mean after a long story, took part of that broadcast two hours at night.

[00:07:33] After the Radio Monte Carlo broadcast ends.

[00:07:36] Right. Transworld Radio from Monte Carlo kicks in.

[00:07:40] And for those who don't know, Transworld Radio is a Christian evangelistic radio now multimedia.

[00:07:47] But based out of Kerry North Carolina, there's a man named Ralph Fried.

[00:07:53] I believe that is right.

[00:07:55] Ralph and Paul Fried, they started in fact the station and the built Transworld Radio.

[00:08:01] It's huge and it's radio only.

[00:08:03] I mean now I believe it's more than 200 languages around the world.

[00:08:08] And they in fact approach Dr. Mike, it used to be on the Arabic broadcast and Dr. Michael insisted on having

[00:08:17] a conversation with the people.

[00:08:18] Then I was in Monte Carlo the year before, maybe here permanently that was 1995.

[00:08:24] And I was amazed of the concept because to have English Arabic broadcast side by side

[00:08:31] because for those who don't know what do a language is, the door language is Dr. Michael would say a sentence in English

[00:08:37] with morning and it comes immediately at Translation in Arabic.

[00:08:43] And then comes the sermon.

[00:08:46] So the concept was strange for the radio, but for Matt we had it in the middle east long

[00:08:53] time ago from missionaries.

[00:08:54] Right.

[00:08:56] And Dr. Michael himself used to translate from the pulpit when he was younger in Egypt.

[00:09:02] So the concept was there, but I mean Dr. Michael came up with the concept to be on radio.

[00:09:07] It was strange, by the way, many pastors in the Arab world and specifically in Egypt rejected the concept on TransworldDread.

[00:09:18] And when they presented the project to me and I said, let's discuss it.

[00:09:23] Let's talk about it.

[00:09:24] Let's see what would bring.

[00:09:26] Will we look like we are occupied by America or by foreigners?

[00:09:31] But I think for the Gospel we would do anything.

[00:09:34] And then I believe I was maybe the only one who said let us try it.

[00:09:39] And here we are after many rejections, the decision was made to try it for six months only.

[00:09:47] On one station as I was telling you, there are two stations, one in Monte Carlo and one in Cyprus.

[00:09:53] The Monte Carlo station broadcasts into North Africa.

[00:09:56] And the Cyprus station broadcasts into the Middle East, Egypt Sudan.

[00:10:02] And you go east on the map.

[00:10:05] So we had the program for six months only on the Cyprus station.

[00:10:10] Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon.

[00:10:16] Jonathan, I can tell you this.

[00:10:18] I personally used to bring the letters back then letters.

[00:10:21] No emails, no form calls.

[00:10:23] Nothing right.

[00:10:24] If we could just do understand.

[00:10:25] I am very happy.

[00:10:26] Absolutely.

[00:10:27] So I used to go to collect the letters from the post office for the best program Arabic program on

[00:10:36] Transladeo station, would bring maybe five ten letters per month.

[00:10:43] For this program once it started, 100, 150, 200 letters per month.

[00:10:51] We couldn't believe our eyes.

[00:10:53] That was a hit.

[00:10:56] And we said, what's going on?

[00:10:58] Something is right.

[00:11:00] Yeah, yeah, we've done something.

[00:11:02] What is it?

[00:11:04] So people loved the format, loved Dr. Michael and the sermon and loved Becky Sadake because

[00:11:10] he is a very good figure in the airport.

[00:11:14] And the program was bringing fruits.

[00:11:16] And we learned later that even English teachers used to assign the program to their students to

[00:11:23] listen to for the English and then we hit the other goal which is listening to the gospel

[00:11:28] Right, which yeah right because it'd be hard to be just doing translation.

[00:11:33] I mean you could do it but obviously the message is going to start chipping away.

[00:11:38] Absolutely.

[00:11:39] People's worldview and even Muslim teachers.

[00:11:43] Not only in Egypt all over the Arab world and in Iran.

[00:11:48] That was amazing to me.

[00:11:49] And then after six months we said, oh wow, apparently the program is bringing amazing fruits.

[00:11:55] So we had the program on Monte Carlo station which means broadcasting into North Africa as well.

[00:12:02] When the idea came, everybody said, no, no, no, it would not work because North Africa speaks mainly French with Arabic.

[00:12:11] And that program is in English.

[00:12:13] It would not sell there but we said, okay, let's have it for six months.

[00:12:18] On the Monte Carlo station right brother brother.

[00:12:22] I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw the letters just pouring in from listeners from Algeria, Morocco, Tunisia, Libya.

[00:12:33] And in fact we had to increase our power of responding to those because it consumed more time and we were not ready for this back then.

[00:12:42] And apparently the program was amazing. So from one program, one episode per week to five episodes per week back then.

[00:12:51] And it had a huge impact on the Arab world.

[00:12:54] And I felt that the Lord's hand is in this because we know that the message is meant to be conveyed the right way.

[00:13:05] And we have been broadcasting for years on transwarderee.

[00:13:09] God bless all the broadcasters, but I do have to Michael had a way to say things.

[00:13:15] And I believe he has a unique way in presenting the truth.

[00:13:21] And also people wanted to learn the language.

[00:13:24] So we married this to that and though the rejection at the beginning and everybody wanted to do the same format of the right to imitate the experience.

[00:13:34] So they found success. We need to replicate this.

[00:13:38] So I mean, that's exactly when I met Dr. Michael in Monte Carlo and we had an amazing friendship with him and the family.

[00:13:48] I saw a godly man who is focused on one thing telling the word about Jesus and his salvation.

[00:13:54] And that was the goal. And exactly that is what happened.

[00:13:59] We started going everywhere in the world.

[00:14:02] And after even Monte Carlo office was closed because of finances and friendship was very expensive, of course.

[00:14:08] We started going everywhere.

[00:14:10] We went to London, went to Cyprus, went to Vienna to record a program and it was very successful.

[00:14:16] That took us to another level of broadcast, which is producing the same program.

[00:14:23] In other languages.

[00:14:26] Right, because it can be wrapped if it's worked in the Middle East.

[00:14:29] Why wouldn't it work in China and India and...

[00:14:32] Right, right.

[00:14:33] And Dr. Michael said something amazing.

[00:14:37] I would not say that again in study.

[00:14:39] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:14:41] His brain had been boiled.

[00:14:42] Exactly.

[00:14:44] With his job.

[00:14:45] Right, right.

[00:14:46] So I mean, the idea came is just to separate the Arabic from the English and we create English tracks of

[00:14:53] every single sentence he says.

[00:14:56] And we send those sentences or those English versions together different translators,

[00:15:02] to different societies, and from that the whole idea of dual language that we have today.

[00:15:08] We have 25 languages with the same format.

[00:15:12] And it proved to be very successful.

[00:15:14] And people are coming to Christ through these messages in an amazing way.

[00:15:18] Learning English and proclaiming the gospel.

[00:15:21] And it is amazing that it wasn't just one region of the world, one language, one people group.

[00:15:26] I mean, it's truly what the Word of God talks about.

[00:15:29] Every people language, nation, tribe, tongue, it's all there, right?

[00:15:34] And they're all...

[00:15:35] Because you and I both had the privilege of traveling to a lot of those different regions of the world.

[00:15:41] And the testimonies, the same, the people were changed and confronted by the truth of the gospel

[00:15:47] and that power of the Holy Spirit and working in them to bring them to salvation.

[00:15:53] So the concept wasn't just for one place, one time, one, you know, people group.

[00:15:58] It really...

[00:15:59] And I was always blown away when I would travel in the similarity of the testimony.

[00:16:05] Completely worlds apart.

[00:16:06] Language is socio-economic status.

[00:16:10] You know, heritage, all of that culture.

[00:16:11] Everything is completely different.

[00:16:13] But the same uniqueness of the power of the gospel to reach these people.

[00:16:17] And now there are brothers and sisters in Christ, though they may never even meet or know each other.

[00:16:22] The beauty about this Jonathan is Dr. Michael is one of that culture.

[00:16:29] So he knows exactly what the culture wants.

[00:16:34] And his messages are simple enough but deep enough for people to get it.

[00:16:39] Right?

[00:16:40] And he crosses...

[00:16:41] Yeah.

[00:16:42] That's right.

[00:16:43] And that's exactly what his messages did.

[00:16:46] That's right.

[00:16:47] And that's why I mean, we see people coming to Christ in the same fashion that applies to Egypt,

[00:16:52] applies to Bangladesh, applies to Indonesia, Australia, I mean, everywhere because it's simple but deep.

[00:17:01] And he knows exactly his audience.

[00:17:04] Yeah.

[00:17:04] And that's a beauty about Michael's context.

[00:17:07] And I had the privilege even to travel with Dr. Michael everywhere.

[00:17:12] And I see the impact of his words on people because it's the Holy Spirit that works behind the scene,

[00:17:19] using his words, understanding the culture, understanding the message.

[00:17:25] And that was unique.

[00:17:26] And till today, it is unique.

[00:17:28] And we apply through even the Ministry of Navigators when we send these messages to every word in the word.

[00:17:35] Let's transition slightly.

[00:17:38] And I want you to tell us a bit about yourself growing up in Egypt, tell us a little bit about your background and have a Lord drew you to himself.

[00:17:46] Simply, I mean, I know the focus is Jesus.

[00:17:49] It's the focus of Jesus, always.

[00:17:51] But I mean, the Lord had unique way in preparing, I believe, me to be in ministry because if you knew me back then, I detested being in any ministry.

[00:18:03] I think even loved ministers.

[00:18:07] I hated ministers and ministers.

[00:18:11] And I tell you why, I was in the Franciscan school in nearby Alexandria.

[00:18:14] I was born in Alexandria in a Christian family.

[00:18:17] People say you are convert from Islam.

[00:18:19] No, I grew up in a Christian family.

[00:18:21] Some people don't know that there's a large Christian population in Egypt.

[00:18:25] Absolutely.

[00:18:26] It's shrinking now.

[00:18:27] But I mean, there is still huge population of Christians in Egypt.

[00:18:31] And I would say nominal Christians because the meaning of Christian here is different from the Middle East.

[00:18:37] Everybody there who has the name Christian is Christian, not necessarily being a believer, right?

[00:18:44] But I mean to tell that truth, I grew up in a Christian family and I used to be in the Franciscan school.

[00:18:51] And it's one of the best schools academically.

[00:18:53] Academically.

[00:18:53] But because of that, I mean monks are responsible for the school in the morning when we are ready to get into the class.

[00:19:03] Christians had to go to the chapel to pray and not everybody wanted to go to the chapel obviously.

[00:19:09] I mean when we were little kids elementary school.

[00:19:12] So and I remember clearly how the principle of the school held a bamboo stick in his hand, chasing us Christians.

[00:19:22] And I took some of those on my butt just to go to that chapel.

[00:19:28] And I was wondering why are they pushing me to go to a place that I don't want to go to.

[00:19:35] And that created in me a hatred towards the school.

[00:19:40] monks priests, chapel, Bible and any kind.

[00:19:44] Anything is relating to this Christian faith.

[00:19:48] I just hated it because I hate to be pushed to do anything.

[00:19:54] Right.

[00:19:55] And back then I didn't understand anything and anything, but I mean I just hated the concept of chasing me with a stick.

[00:20:02] Right.

[00:20:02] So do something that is against my will.

[00:20:05] And that was deep down in my heart.

[00:20:09] So I used to go to churches with my family and I just as a regular church gore.

[00:20:15] And of course maybe people remember the six day war, 1967 when Israel and Egypt were in war.

[00:20:25] And Egypt was defeated big time and until the dictator Nasser had to resign.

[00:20:31] Back then we used to listen to the radio from Israel in Arabic.

[00:20:37] And we hear the propaganda.

[00:20:40] We are the chosen people of God.

[00:20:42] We are victorious because we belong to God.

[00:20:45] We know God and then I go to church.

[00:20:50] And I hear Jesus is the only way.

[00:20:53] And then I go to school and there is a curriculum that we have to memorize parts of the Quran.

[00:21:00] The Islamic book.

[00:21:02] And Muslims say the only religion accepted by God is Islam.

[00:21:08] So I became very confused.

[00:21:11] Choosing people of God, Jesus is the only way.

[00:21:14] Islam is the only accepted religion by God.

[00:21:17] And I said okay, apparently somebody's wrong.

[00:21:20] Somebody's wrong.

[00:21:21] Somebody's right.

[00:21:22] And because of the deep hate in my heart towards anything religious, I decided to kick God completely out of my life.

[00:21:31] Right.

[00:21:31] And I said God, I'm done with you.

[00:21:33] If you exist, I don't care if you don't exist.

[00:21:35] That's better.

[00:21:37] And my life will go on without you, without any impact.

[00:21:41] And I continue my life this way until I was 17.

[00:21:44] And I used to go to some or camps with the church.

[00:21:47] And I used to go just to flirt with girls and also I'm in to for the firing.

[00:21:52] Most boys.

[00:21:53] Absolutely.

[00:21:54] I mean, I was an expert.

[00:21:57] And I used to go for food for the fire and for the jokes and things.

[00:22:00] And then we all had to sit at night to listen to somebody saying something from the Bible.

[00:22:06] And I said okay, same trash again.

[00:22:09] I don't care to me.

[00:22:11] I just turn off my brain, my eyes and sleep.

[00:22:16] And then one night I heard something that bothered me big time.

[00:22:21] I don't remember anything except one sentence.

[00:22:24] Where will you spend your eternity?

[00:22:28] In fact, I didn't care much about this.

[00:22:30] And I said okay again, that's nothing I don't need to think of.

[00:22:34] I mean, it doesn't exist.

[00:22:36] So I went back home but the words started spinning in my head.

[00:22:43] I mean, I couldn't resist the notion and for those who know me, I'm a bookworm.

[00:22:48] I love reading books like crazy.

[00:22:51] So and then I had a challenge with God.

[00:22:54] I said okay.

[00:22:55] I will read the books that they call holy books.

[00:23:00] I just want to know, to know exactly if you don't exist or you exist and I will follow you.

[00:23:08] So I started reading the Quran in Arabic.

[00:23:12] I read the whole Quran, the 114 chapters.

[00:23:17] I locked myself in my room in fact.

[00:23:21] Until my mom was worried about me.

[00:23:23] I was going to read the Quran in the room and she said,

[00:23:27] what's going on with this little kid?

[00:23:30] I was 17 years old.

[00:23:33] And then I read the whole Bible.

[00:23:35] The whole Bible.

[00:23:36] I was committed to reading it from cover to cover.

[00:23:40] I just want to know.

[00:23:43] Then I raised the question.

[00:23:46] Who of you prophets?

[00:23:49] Moses, Muhammad and Jesus.

[00:23:52] Who of you would give me any notion about my eternity that they say,

[00:23:57] where will you spend your eternity at the same words kept spinning?

[00:24:01] Who of you would guarantee my eternity?

[00:24:05] Moses was given the ten commandments and apparently I failed the test,

[00:24:09] miserably because I am doing many of them.

[00:24:13] I said apparently Moses has nothing to do with me because he has no guarantee,

[00:24:18] no assurance.

[00:24:19] And then I went to Muhammad and what shocked me, Jonathan, about Muhammad,

[00:24:25] that he himself said from the books of the Hadith and the Hadith books are

[00:24:31] the words and deeds of Muhammad.

[00:24:34] When somebody said to him, Muhammad, you surely will be in paradise or heaven.

[00:24:39] And he rebuked the person saying, who told you this?

[00:24:44] I, the prophet of Islam, don't know where I will be.

[00:24:51] And I was shocked.

[00:24:52] So how can I follow confidence, no interference, right?

[00:24:55] He said, how can I follow a person who has no assurance whatsoever of what he will be after himself?

[00:25:02] Right.

[00:25:03] And then I came to Jesus and just said, you don't need to do anything.

[00:25:08] Just trust in me, believe in what I did for you on the cross.

[00:25:12] That will wipe your sense away and you will know here and now that your eternity is guaranteed in me.

[00:25:21] During the time I used to sleep alone in my bed.

[00:25:26] And then I got a dream.

[00:25:30] I saw Jesus in my dreams and I recognized him, shiny face, huge figure.

[00:25:39] And once I recognized him, I turned and wanted to run away.

[00:25:46] When I started running away from him, for some reason I felt that his hand landed on my back.

[00:25:55] In fact, I shake when I remember these moments.

[00:25:59] And I turned my face towards him and he said, don't escape.

[00:26:06] You belong to me.

[00:26:09] And from that time something changed in me.

[00:26:13] I woke up in the morning, Jonathan, you will not believe it.

[00:26:15] I could not believe it.

[00:26:16] I had no explanation.

[00:26:18] His hand was giving me pain where it landed on my back.

[00:26:23] And I sleep alone nobody kicks me or anything.

[00:26:26] For the whole day, his hand was heavy on me.

[00:26:30] He wanted me to come back to him.

[00:26:34] After my readings and after that dream,

[00:26:37] I knew that I belonged to that person.

[00:26:42] And my life was completely changed.

[00:26:46] In your personal's book, I mean, I experienced this feeling

[00:26:49] that many experience in the world.

[00:26:53] Because the power of change is something that you feel.

[00:26:56] It's not something that you imagine or it's emotional.

[00:27:00] No, I mean, this is the power of change.

[00:27:02] I became a different person.

[00:27:04] A person that I didn't know before.

[00:27:07] And his love was poured in my heart.

[00:27:10] And his love towards Muslims was even born better.

[00:27:17] Because we are dealt with in a way, in Egypt.

[00:27:25] I would say persecution though there is persecution.

[00:27:28] In Egypt and the whole Arab world.

[00:27:31] But we are different.

[00:27:32] We are second class citizens in the Arab world.

[00:27:36] But though the enmity or maybe the hatred Muslims have towards us Christians,

[00:27:43] I had love in abundance for them.

[00:27:46] Because I now understand where they stand.

[00:27:50] I understand the religion.

[00:27:51] I understand that deception in the religion.

[00:27:55] So that led me to lead Caravans and go and I play music to go with my accordion

[00:28:03] to villages around Alexandria and all over Egypt, just to reach out to Christians.

[00:28:09] But from the back doors Muslims come to watch us and to hear the gospel.

[00:28:14] And you can feel the power of change, Jonathan.

[00:28:19] It's unbelievable.

[00:28:21] Something that I am not acceptable.

[00:28:23] I cannot explain it because that's the power of the Holy Spirit.

[00:28:27] It's not in my words, not in anybody's word.

[00:28:30] It's the Holy Spirit that changes lives.

[00:28:33] And I can tell many came to Christ through the Caravans.

[00:28:37] From the Muslim community.

[00:28:40] And during that time there was even something like a revival in Egypt because of the word of God is so powerful.

[00:28:48] And it was penetrating the hearts and minds of Muslims in this part of the word.

[00:28:53] But long story short, I graduated as an architect from the engineering college.

[00:28:59] And I went to the army.

[00:29:01] It's obligatory.

[00:29:02] So I had to go to the army.

[00:29:05] I had to carry a machine gun in my name, written in my name, in my bag with a machine gun.

[00:29:09] I mean, I couldn't believe it.

[00:29:12] But Chris got that in anybody.

[00:29:14] And after that I was invited by many ministers to be part of them.

[00:29:19] One of the most camps crusade, which is true today.

[00:29:23] In fact, I hated all those who are in ministers because I feel that they are just doing nothing.

[00:29:29] And I as an engineer, I used to be in the field.

[00:29:34] I deal with workers engineers.

[00:29:36] I mean, people contractors, people from every direction of the world.

[00:29:40] And I was used to tell them working in the field for me is an opportunity to evangelize more than what you do.

[00:29:47] Why are you sitting behind this?

[00:29:49] A professional evangelist.

[00:29:52] I love it.

[00:29:53] And until the day I'm in long story short that they came when transored,

[00:29:56] you asked me to join them and I rejected the idea completely.

[00:30:00] I said, why?

[00:30:01] I'm in a successful engineer.

[00:30:03] I have my own office.

[00:30:04] I go to villages and I play music.

[00:30:08] And I, in general, have no clue about it.

[00:30:14] Right.

[00:30:14] And I don't know what life is there.

[00:30:16] And I have a family.

[00:30:18] I refused completely to go to Monte Carlo, Monaco, with transored radio.

[00:30:24] Until the day came again when I heard it clear, my wife and I,

[00:30:30] we prayed, prayed, prayed until the Lord was clear.

[00:30:33] Magged, you are not here to build your kingdom.

[00:30:38] You are here to build my kingdom.

[00:30:41] I heard that you are nothing.

[00:30:43] And that day was another day, new dawn in my life.

[00:30:47] Because that day I said, I will leave everything behind.

[00:30:52] My work, my office, my achievements looked nothing to me to serve the Lord.

[00:30:59] Going to the unknown like Abraham.

[00:31:02] I mean, it's tip and nothing in the air.

[00:31:06] So my family and I went to Monte Carlo 1996.

[00:31:11] This is the year when I met with Dr. Mike Elusive.

[00:31:14] And there is just history.

[00:31:15] Yeah, that's amazing.

[00:31:18] And the Lord has guided you ever since then through so many different avenues and you're using your,

[00:31:27] the giftings that the Lord is giving you, not to sit behind a desk and do nothing.

[00:31:31] But to have opportunity to go into the field,

[00:31:34] but also to be an equipper and an encourager of others who are in the field as well.

[00:31:40] I was so blessed Jonathan to say the following.

[00:31:43] I was part of a huge ministry like Transport Radio, blessed my life,

[00:31:49] knowing people like Mike Elusive and others.

[00:31:54] Satan was attacking me in Monte Carlo when I was sitting behind the mixer,

[00:31:59] that this right.

[00:32:02] And he used to tell me, you have no impact on nobody.

[00:32:07] I'm sure I could feel like that.

[00:32:09] I feel like I should say that.

[00:32:10] I'm feeling with technical equipment and exactly until I went to the field.

[00:32:16] And I heard the radio on Cairo streets, Dr. Michael's teaching.

[00:32:22] And I heard the stemones of people coming to Christ through his teaching.

[00:32:28] That was a new day for in my life because we have an impact.

[00:32:32] We are making a huge impact for the gospel of Jesus Christ.

[00:32:36] And that's exactly what encouraged me and my family to stay there.

[00:32:41] I was planning in fact to stay two years in Monte Carlo,

[00:32:45] but it went to be eight years.

[00:32:48] And then it's another testimony in my life.

[00:32:51] I mean they decided to close the office in Monte Carlo.

[00:32:55] And I decided to resign because I had a status with America.

[00:33:00] I had the green card.

[00:33:01] I want to just go to America to have it.

[00:33:03] Then go anywhere in the world.

[00:33:05] I don't care where, but I mean just to for me to have something that would open doors

[00:33:11] would help the ministry advance everywhere.

[00:33:13] And there is another story here, but I mean make a long story short.

[00:33:17] I wanted to go to an Arab country like Morocco.

[00:33:20] And I had to wait one year to get the visa as an Egyptian.

[00:33:24] But for Americans it's open-wise.

[00:33:27] I said, okay, I would love to get this.

[00:33:29] And I didn't understand what it means to have an American passport.

[00:33:32] But just to have this for those to be open before me to teach the gospel.

[00:33:38] Take out of these places.

[00:33:39] Long story short, I had a status with America but the leadership of Transworld,

[00:33:44] that you said no, you will not go to America.

[00:33:46] And I said, okay, sorry, I have to resign because I am serving the Lord.

[00:33:50] I'm not serving buddies or institutes or companies or organizations.

[00:33:56] So the day I resigned, Jonathan,

[00:34:01] and that was rare. I got the message from Dr. Michael use in my inbox.

[00:34:08] Till today I don't know how this happened.

[00:34:12] And he said, maggot, I heard that you are resigning from Transworld Radio.

[00:34:17] And I responded, how did you know?

[00:34:21] Well who told you, don't worry, I mean I just want to see you.

[00:34:25] What do you have for me, I said, can we see you here in Atlanta?

[00:34:30] And I said, ironically, I'll be in Atlanta in two weeks just to renew my citizenship or my residency.

[00:34:36] Right? I came here with Dr. Michael use of that was a privilege.

[00:34:40] The privilege of my life, I mean when he offered me a job here to be the international director.

[00:34:46] And I feel that this was the Lord's hand in my life.

[00:34:50] He meant something for me. I didn't know it. I didn't understand it.

[00:34:54] But I had one thing in my life to honor God, to celebrate Jesus in my life.

[00:35:01] And that was the lead. When Dr. Michael offered me the job,

[00:35:05] I accepted happily, I rejoiced because when I loved the man,

[00:35:12] I loved to serve God through such a solid ministry.

[00:35:16] Yeah, like Michael Yesves. So three months later I was here in Atlanta and we started establishing what we call today the international department.

[00:35:26] And it was an amazing experience because we started collecting every production that Dr. Michael had in all other languages,

[00:35:34] also for TV, we had a revolution in fact when we started here 2004.

[00:35:40] And I remember those days we were so blessed to have a department that is serving the Lord through many languages.

[00:35:50] And that was the privilege of my life to be part of this.

[00:35:54] And since I landed here, we were broadcasting Dr. Michael's TV show with Arabic subtitles on Amosatolite.

[00:36:03] And in fact, I didn't like the idea because Amosatolite is Israeli, Satolite.

[00:36:10] And I said to Dr. Michael, that will not sound good.

[00:36:15] They're not being received well by the Arabs. Those are our target audience.

[00:36:21] And he said, we dream of a channel, of our own.

[00:36:26] Yeah. And that was the dream Dr. Michael had and I had from the beginning.

[00:36:32] And then everything started when Dr. Michael was an Egypt preaching when somebody asked him the question,

[00:36:39] and he was a convert, Muslim convert. He asked him, I have a sincere question.

[00:36:44] What it means for somebody below at somebody and they fall, the story is well known.

[00:36:49] The penocastal. The penocastal activities.

[00:36:53] So, and Dr. Michael said, I was so embarrassed even to answer the question.

[00:36:58] And that was the time when he said, we have to start a channel.

[00:37:03] Yeah. And the Lord answered our prayers.

[00:37:07] The Lord put on one of our donors' heart to give towards reaching out to Muslims in the Arab world.

[00:37:13] And he came to Dr. Michael and put on the table $1 million.

[00:37:19] And said, the Michael, I want you to use the money to bring Muslims to Christ.

[00:37:26] And then I cannot forget the day when we were checking who would start this channel.

[00:37:34] And I remember that clearly, Dr. Michael Joshua and myself, we used to interview people to be the one or the ones that are responsible for the starting of the channel.

[00:37:49] And Dr. Michael didn't like any of them.

[00:37:52] And then the day came when he told me, man, apparently the Lord is saying that you are the one to start it.

[00:38:00] I was in tears. I was literally in tears. I tell you why.

[00:38:05] That was the year 2008.

[00:38:10] 1990, Jonathan, this is how the Lord puts the puzzle together.

[00:38:15] 1990, I was in Egypt, I was producing dubbed shows for the Christian media.

[00:38:23] Right. And there was an opportunity for me to learn how to produce for TV.

[00:38:30] And I said, now I don't care. I don't want.

[00:38:34] And then the people who offered me insisted for some reason, I don't know why.

[00:38:39] Right. I don't know why.

[00:38:41] But I ended up taking the course.

[00:38:44] Food course, how to write, how to produce, how to run a camera, how to do it.

[00:38:48] Right, a scenario, everything.

[00:38:51] But I have never used it 1990.

[00:38:53] Right. And I said, why did you allow me to take something like this?

[00:38:58] 18 years later.

[00:38:59] Here we are. That's why I was in tears because that was God's hand in my life.

[00:39:04] Through Dr. Michael Joseph's words, you will start this.

[00:39:09] And I mean, I cannot tell you about the privilege I had.

[00:39:12] And the days that we couldn't sleep for.

[00:39:14] Yeah, so there was a lot of heavy lifting.

[00:39:16] It was really heavy. And I had to travel the world to just find a station that would broadcast something like this Christian channel.

[00:39:25] It was a challenge. But when I remember those days, all the pain goes away because the fruits of this was humongous.

[00:39:34] Beyond the description. I tell you one funny thing that I think you love it and the audience will love it.

[00:39:40] When we started the channel, we couldn't find any satellite to broadcast.

[00:39:46] So we went to an neighboring country.

[00:39:48] I mean, I would say Israel.

[00:39:49] And we had to broadcast from there.

[00:39:54] And once we started, we were attacked like crazy by all Muslims.

[00:39:58] But it was okay.

[00:40:00] We couldn't broadcast on Nile set. Nile set is an Egyptian satellite owned by Egypt and the government.

[00:40:08] By the government.

[00:40:09] Yeah.

[00:40:09] So Mubarak, the president of Egypt back then said, I will not broadcast the Quran.

[00:40:14] I will not broadcast the Christian faith.

[00:40:17] Not Islamic content, no Christian content.

[00:40:21] And he prevented any religious content to be on Nile set.

[00:40:26] And then three months after we started, we started by the way in March 2009, the Kingdom set TV.

[00:40:34] Three months later, I received a call from a broker and he said,

[00:40:39] I will not broadcast the message.

[00:40:40] You want to be on Nile set and I said, brother, that's a joke.

[00:40:44] It's impossible.

[00:40:46] That's a scam.

[00:40:47] Don't believe it.

[00:40:48] Is it?

[00:40:49] No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[00:40:49] Okay, you don't believe it.

[00:40:50] I will have the Kingdom set channel on Nile set for three days free.

[00:40:56] And I said, what?

[00:40:58] We have been praying about this, but the road answered amazingly.

[00:41:02] Guess what?

[00:41:03] Three days of broadcasting Kingdom set on Nile set.

[00:41:07] I had a budget to promote Kingdom set, but I stopped it.

[00:41:13] You know why?

[00:41:14] We have been attacked like crazy by all Islamic websites on Mediary.

[00:41:20] Three, three, three, three.

[00:41:22] And that was amazing.

[00:41:24] Don't listen to a frequency blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:41:28] At this time, at the night set, the government is allowing Christian propaganda and the evangelism

[00:41:34] for coming from the back door.

[00:41:36] And it said, press God.

[00:41:38] That was amazing.

[00:41:40] That was amazing.

[00:41:41] But three months later, but I received another phone call from the same broker said,

[00:41:46] make it, do you want to be on Arab set?

[00:41:49] And for those who don't know Arab set is owned by Saudi Arabia, both casting from Bahrain.

[00:41:56] Wow.

[00:41:56] And I said, brother, listen.

[00:41:59] We pray about that was in Ukraine this season.

[00:42:01] We have been praying about Nile set, but we didn't pray about Arabsat because we know that God wouldn't allow it.

[00:42:07] But apparently God was behind all of this.

[00:42:11] And he allowed for us to be on Arab set.

[00:42:13] For three years, we signed a contract with the government of Saudi Arabia.

[00:42:17] It was once and it never happened again by the way, for Kingdom set.

[00:42:22] And many would blissed in a region that is really, really dark and dry.

[00:42:27] And the Lord used the tomacles.

[00:42:29] And all the partners we had back then those who believed in the calling that the tomacle had,

[00:42:35] it was amazing.

[00:42:36] I was living time of heaven on earth.

[00:42:40] Only the hard work behind it was taking us away.

[00:42:45] But it was the same thing.

[00:42:47] Or kestra of love and joy because you see.

[00:42:52] You have solid teaching.

[00:42:53] There were some channels back then that were broadcasting the gospel, but very shallow.

[00:42:58] But Dr. Michael's concept was to take it to the deep of the gospel,

[00:43:03] the depth of the gospel.

[00:43:05] And that's exactly what we had.

[00:43:06] And we had amazing names like David Jeremiah, R.C. Sproul,

[00:43:11] big names and later we had John MacArthur, all the big names that are solid and also impactful.

[00:43:18] And that's how people now love the Kingdom set and many follow it.

[00:43:24] Those who seek the truth, those who want to know.

[00:43:28] But those who want to just attack, we get many of those everyday.

[00:43:32] But those who seek to know the truth,

[00:43:34] we have a team on the ground today that is ready to meet with people to take them,

[00:43:39] to disciple them, to baptize them.

[00:43:41] In the Arab world every year I go through the Arab countries, to baptize people.

[00:43:46] And their own country, Muslims come to Christ.

[00:43:50] People say that's impossible.

[00:43:53] America has happened every day.

[00:43:55] We witnessed it.

[00:43:55] We witnessed for the love of Jesus, penetrating the hearts and people are coming in abundance in an amazing way we haven't witnessed before.

[00:44:06] Oh, we rejoice in God's overruling and His sovereign hand in lining all those up.

[00:44:14] I wonder just as we sort of wrap up here, if you can share with us maybe one story,

[00:44:19] you don't have to use names, of course, or anything.

[00:44:21] But one story of great impact, all conversions, of course, are of the highest impact.

[00:44:28] But maybe one that would just kind of resonate with the listeners.

[00:44:32] I know you could tell a million.

[00:44:34] You look overwhelmed and having to pick one.

[00:44:37] I can ten hundred thousand stories, but I mean,

[00:44:40] each story, as you said, is amazing.

[00:44:43] One story stands out.

[00:44:46] I received a phone call from my team in Egypt, telling me that there is a guy that wants to get baptized and his emosselam.

[00:44:56] But his background is scary.

[00:44:59] And I said, what do you mean?

[00:45:01] And they said, when you come, you will know.

[00:45:04] And when will you come?

[00:45:05] I said, I'm coming next week.

[00:45:06] It happened that I'm in Egypt next week.

[00:45:08] So I went to Egypt and I met with the guy.

[00:45:14] I couldn't believe my ears.

[00:45:17] He said, you don't know who I am.

[00:45:20] I am the bookkeeper of my families and sisters that go back to Muhammad, the prophet of Islam.

[00:45:29] I keep the family tree to make sure that we all are connected to him to Muhammad.

[00:45:38] And I said, and you want to get baptized now?

[00:45:42] You're going to cut the limb off the tree.

[00:45:45] He started a new tree.

[00:45:47] And he said, he said, make it believe me.

[00:45:51] I find this now as trash.

[00:45:54] And I cannot forget his words.

[00:45:57] I gained Jesus and that for me was enough.

[00:46:01] I don't care about the tree.

[00:46:02] I don't care about Muhammad.

[00:46:03] I don't care about Quran or anything.

[00:46:06] I found Jesus.

[00:46:08] And that's why I'm here.

[00:46:09] We were in fact standing at the pool and I have videos of this.

[00:46:13] I was standing at the pool and he was ready to jump in.

[00:46:17] And I said to him, do you know what this means?

[00:46:19] The world will hate you.

[00:46:21] Your family may persecute you and may kill you.

[00:46:24] Yeah.

[00:46:25] And he said, I don't care.

[00:46:27] And I'm ready even to be used by Jesus.

[00:46:29] And we had to bring some pastor from Lebanon.

[00:46:34] Right?

[00:46:35] To baptize him because many pastors in Egypt refused.

[00:46:38] For scarier church.

[00:46:39] Scared to even touch him.

[00:46:41] You're around him.

[00:46:42] So we had him in a far church and on the mountains in Egypt.

[00:46:47] And we had a pool there and he jumped in the pool.

[00:46:51] I couldn't believe that tears coming from his eyes at that moment.

[00:46:55] People leave the world for the sake of Jesus.

[00:46:59] And this is a reality cannot be denied.

[00:47:03] It's not the work of anybody, it's not the effort of anybody.

[00:47:06] It's the work of the Holy Spirit through the teaching,

[00:47:09] like Dr. Mike's teaching and other's teaching.

[00:47:12] The Lord is using the words to change the word.

[00:47:15] And that's a beauty of what we are doing.

[00:47:17] We are working for a God that is worthy of our work and our labor.

[00:47:23] And he's taking care of everything else.

[00:47:25] What better situation we have?

[00:47:27] Well, the harvest is plentiful.

[00:47:29] The workers are few but you brother are a good faithful worker.

[00:47:34] And we thank God for you.

[00:47:36] And so thank you for sharing all of that with us.

[00:47:39] I think surely our listeners have been deeply edified by hearing your own testimony

[00:47:45] and the testimony of others that are coming to no Christ.

[00:47:49] Amen. Thank you very much for having me.

[00:47:51] Thank you.

[00:47:52] Candidate is a podcast from Leading the Way with Dr. Michael Usaf.

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